US Politics Megathread

[fightinfrenchman]

Good speech by Biden

[princeofcarthage]

Was there ever any doubt that he will be declared not guilty? Do you really think jurors would have invoked the wrath of an entire nation? I am not saying he was innocent but even if he was there was no chance of him being found one. FYI Before you nitpick something and accuse me falsely of something, I think the verdict was correct.

Nop, justice in the USA is quite political, due to the jury system, which links social/community/political pressure with legal proceedings outcomes.
That's why, for example, Manson was never released, though technically he never committed a literal crime, he was imprisoned for life for something like conspiracy to murder or mind control. Ridiculous.

I am confused, you are basically agreeing with what I said, right? More or less

[princeofcarthage]

Was there ever any doubt that he will be declared not guilty? Do you really think jurors would have invoked the wrath of an entire nation? I am not saying he was innocent but even if he was there was no chance of him being found one. FYI Before you nitpick something and accuse me falsely of something, I think the verdict was correct.

I absolutely was worried he would not be convicted. It would have only taken one juror, and we've seen this play out a million times

Do you need unanimous votes for guilty verdict?

[fightinfrenchman]

Was there ever any doubt that he will be declared not guilty? Do you really think jurors would have invoked the wrath of an entire nation? I am not saying he was innocent but even if he was there was no chance of him being found one. FYI Before you nitpick something and accuse me falsely of something, I think the verdict was correct.

I absolutely was worried he would not be convicted. It would have only taken one juror, and we've seen this play out a million times

Do you need unanimous votes for guilty verdict?

Yes

[princeofcarthage]

Show hidden quotes

Was there ever any doubt that he will be declared not guilty? Do you really think jurors would have invoked the wrath of an entire nation? I am not saying he was innocent but even if he was there was no chance of him being found one. FYI Before you nitpick something and accuse me falsely of something, I think the verdict was correct.

I absolutely was worried he would not be convicted. It would have only taken one juror, and we've seen this play out a million times

Do you need unanimous votes for guilty verdict?

Yes

That is bad.

[Dolan]

Was there ever any doubt that he will be declared not guilty? Do you really think jurors would have invoked the wrath of an entire nation? I am not saying he was innocent but even if he was there was no chance of him being found one. FYI Before you nitpick something and accuse me falsely of something, I think the verdict was correct.

Nop, justice in the USA is quite political, due to the jury system, which links social/community/political pressure with legal proceedings outcomes.
That's why, for example, Manson was never released, though technically he never committed a literal crime, he was imprisoned for life for something like conspiracy to murder or mind control. Ridiculous.

I am confused, you are basically agreeing with what I said, right? More or less

Welp, read the context. It's all down to culture. The justice system in the USA reflects this Puritan, moralistic mission to heal the soul of the community, hallelujah. Justice has been done, families can now get through their grief, brothers and sisters into Consumerism and GDP Growth (may their names be holy) can go back to their normal, productive lives and get on with the task of saving their souls through work and capital accumulation.

[fightinfrenchman]

Thank you for the analysis, guy who doesn't live in the US and thinks racism isn't real

[princeofcarthage]

Show hidden quotes

Was there ever any doubt that he will be declared not guilty? Do you really think jurors would have invoked the wrath of an entire nation? I am not saying he was innocent but even if he was there was no chance of him being found one. FYI Before you nitpick something and accuse me falsely of something, I think the verdict was correct.

Nop, justice in the USA is quite political, due to the jury system, which links social/community/political pressure with legal proceedings outcomes.
That's why, for example, Manson was never released, though technically he never committed a literal crime, he was imprisoned for life for something like conspiracy to murder or mind control. Ridiculous.

I am confused, you are basically agreeing with what I said, right? More or less

Welp, read the context. It's all down to culture. The justice system in the USA reflects this Puritan, moralistic mission to heal the soul of the community, hallelujah. Justice has been done, families can now get through their grief, brothers and sisters into Consumerism and GDP Growth (may their names be holy) can go back to their normal, productive lives and get on with the task of saving their souls through work and capital accumulation.

Still...doesn't answer the question. It's a simple Yes, No, or More or less answer. How hard can it be. This is bad.

[fightinfrenchman]

Most evil person in America

[fightinfrenchman]

Remember when leftists in this thread were saying this guy made some good points lol

[XeeleeFlower]

Was there ever any doubt that he will be declared not guilty? Do you really think jurors would have invoked the wrath of an entire nation? I am not saying he was innocent but even if he was there was no chance of him being found one. FYI Before you nitpick something and accuse me falsely of something, I think the verdict was correct.

Nop, justice in the USA is quite political, due to the jury system, which links social/community/political pressure with legal proceedings outcomes.
That's why, for example, Manson was never released, though technically he never committed a literal crime, he was imprisoned for life for something like conspiracy to murder or mind control. Ridiculous.

George Zimmerman

[fightinfrenchman]

That's why, for example, Manson was never released, though technically he never committed a literal crime, he was imprisoned for life for something like conspiracy to murder or mind control. Ridiculous.

MRW my sentencing is purely political and I didn't actually commit any crimes

On October 5, 1970, Manson attempted to kill Judge Older while the jury was present in the room. Manson first threatened Older, and then jumped over his lawyer's table with a sharpened pencil, in the direction of Older. Manson was restrained before reaching the judge. While being led out of the courtroom, Manson screamed at Older, "In the name of Christian justice, someone should cut your head off!" Meanwhile, the female defendants began chanting something in Latin. Judge Older began wearing a .38 caliber pistol to the trial afterwards.

[Dolan]

Was there ever any doubt that he will be declared not guilty? Do you really think jurors would have invoked the wrath of an entire nation? I am not saying he was innocent but even if he was there was no chance of him being found one. FYI Before you nitpick something and accuse me falsely of something, I think the verdict was correct.

Nop, justice in the USA is quite political, due to the jury system, which links social/community/political pressure with legal proceedings outcomes.
That's why, for example, Manson was never released, though technically he never committed a literal crime, he was imprisoned for life for something like conspiracy to murder or mind control. Ridiculous.

George Zimmerman

Well, let's see.

Before this case happened, Republicans passed a "Stand Your Ground" law in Florida and the verdict in the Zimmerman case was due during election year. There was some concern that if this case was justified using SYG, this could have looked bad in elections for Repubs.

The initial prosecutor, Norm Wolfinger, was apparently close to Republicans, but he was replaced on the case at some point with Angela Corey, who later ran for Republicans in some elections. The prosecutor was appointed by Republican Florida Governor Rick Scott.

Florida has had Republican governors since 1998.

Seems to me what I said about the link between the political and the judiciary in the USA holds. Except that in this case, it applied in the other direction.

Other examples:
Timothy Thomason - the judge appointed by Republicans who ruled in favour of investigating elections in the Maricopa County, basically a victory for Trump, since it "confirmed" his allegations that there have been irregularities during elections.
Christine Fizzano Cannon - judge from Pennsylvania who ruled that Trump observers could monitor the process of counting the votes, after a lower court rejected this. (Not sure why you'd even need such a ruling, normally all parties should have observers at polling sites.)
Matthew W. Brann - PA judge who threw out Trump's team case to block the certification of 7m votes is also Republican, though probably from the moderate/neoliberal wing.
Christopher M. Murray, appointee of former Republican Gov. John Engler, ruled that the way in which absentee ballots were implemented or counted violated state laws, which is in favour of Trump's campaign.

So whether judicial proceedings are done through jury or are the prerogative of judges, there's a political component in how justice is done in the USA.

[fightinfrenchman]

Show hidden quotes

Was there ever any doubt that he will be declared not guilty? Do you really think jurors would have invoked the wrath of an entire nation? I am not saying he was innocent but even if he was there was no chance of him being found one. FYI Before you nitpick something and accuse me falsely of something, I think the verdict was correct.

Nop, justice in the USA is quite political, due to the jury system, which links social/community/political pressure with legal proceedings outcomes.
That's why, for example, Manson was never released, though technically he never committed a literal crime, he was imprisoned for life for something like conspiracy to murder or mind control. Ridiculous.

George Zimmerman

Well, let's see.

Before this case happened, Republicans passed a "Stand Your Ground" law in Florida and the verdict in the Zimmerman case was due during election year. There was some concern that if this case was justified using SYG, this could have looked bad in elections for Repubs.

The initial prosecutor, Norm Wolfinger, was apparently close to Republicans, but he was replaced on the case at some point with Angela Corey, who later ran for Republicans in some elections. The prosecutor was appointed by Republican Florida Governor Rick Scott.

Florida has had Republican governors since 1998.

Seems to me what I said about the link between the political and the judiciary in the USA holds. Except that in this case, it applied in the other direction.

Other examples:
Timothy Thomason - the judge appointed by Republicans who ruled in favour of investigating elections in the Maricopa County, basically a victory for Trump, since it "confirmed" his allegations that there have been irregularities during elections.
Christine Fizzano Cannon - judge from Pennsylvania who ruled that Trump observers could monitor the process of counting the votes, after a lower court rejected this. (Not sure why you'd even need such a ruling, normally all parties should have observers at polling sites.)
Matthew W. Brann - PA judge who threw out Trump's team case to block the certification of 7m votes is also Republican, though probably from the moderate/neoliberal wing.
Christopher M. Murray, appointee of former Republican Gov. John Engler, ruled that the way in which absentee ballots were implemented or counted violated state laws, which is in favour of Trump's campaign.

So whether judicial proceedings are done through jury or are the prerogative of judges, there's a political component in how justice is done in the USA.

Do you think that Derek Chauvin murdered George Floyd? Do you think that racism is bad?

[Snuden]

[chris1089]

Most evil person in America

I thought that was Trump?

[chris1089]

Prosecution messed up any case they did have against Chavin by telling a bunch of lies and appealing to emotion rather than reason in the closing argument.

I'm glad you weren't in charge of the prosecution

A few weeks training and I think I would have done a better job tbh. He lied so much. Complete miscarriage of justice that this guy got second degree murder, given that he was following the police department handbook. Based on the terrible argument the prosecution made, he shouldn't even have got manslaughter. Clearly social pressure influencing the jury.

[princeofcarthage]

Prosecution messed up any case they did have against Chavin by telling a bunch of lies and appealing to emotion rather than reason in the closing argument.

I'm glad you weren't in charge of the prosecution

A few weeks training and I think I would have done a better job tbh. He lied so much. Complete miscarriage of justice that this guy got second degree murder, given that he was following the police department handbook. Based on the terrible argument the prosecution made, he shouldn't even have got manslaughter. Clearly social pressure influencing the jury.

I kind off agree with you, though I think it was fair he got guilty verdict. I am not sure in what handbook you are allowed to put pressure on man's neck and not allow him to breathe. American extreme capitalism has led to bussinessification of everything including law and justice. If you have right information you can get away with many crimes in deals. Then you have private for profit prisons. The whole system is a mess and it's high time they change it.

[princeofcarthage]

The trial should have been behind closed doors with Grand/anonymous Jury to prevent pressures.

[chris1089]

@princeofcarthage this is the protocol. I agree with you that it shouldn't be protocol. Therefore I think your issue is with the police training. Given that Chauvin acted in line with his training, I don't see how this can be murder.

https://www.kare11.com/mobile/article/n ... a1237fc496

[harcha]

For a good while it's been out there that their training is shit. And even the police chief testified against him regarding following procedure. https://roguerocket.com/2021/04/06/minn ... e-chauvin/

I can agree that the verdict on these charges is probably stricter than what the evidence proves, but he was made to be an example, and that is what USA needed now.

[fightinfrenchman]

Prosecution messed up any case they did have against Chavin by telling a bunch of lies and appealing to emotion rather than reason in the closing argument.

I'm glad you weren't in charge of the prosecution

A few weeks training and I think I would have done a better job tbh. He lied so much. Complete miscarriage of justice that this guy got second degree murder, given that he was following the police department handbook. Based on the terrible argument the prosecution made, he shouldn't even have got manslaughter. Clearly social pressure influencing the jury.

He killed someone, dipshit

[fightinfrenchman]

For a good while it's been out there that their training is shit. And even the police chief testified against him regarding following procedure. https://roguerocket.com/2021/04/06/minn ... e-chauvin/

I can agree that the verdict on these charges is probably stricter than what the evidence proves, but he was made to be an example, and that is what USA needed now.

No, it wasn't an example. He literally murdered a guy on camera. Why would he not go to jail for that?

[fightinfrenchman]

@princeofcarthage this is the protocol. I agree with you that it shouldn't be protocol. Therefore I think your issue is with the police training. Given that Chauvin acted in line with his training, I don't see how this can be murder.

https://www.kare11.com/mobile/article/n ... a1237fc496

It's likely due to the fact that the training he received on how to effectively murder someone led to someone dying. Generally that's frowned upon because it's murder. Hope this clears things up

[XeeleeFlower]

@princeofcarthage this is the protocol. I agree with you that it shouldn't be protocol. Therefore I think your issue is with the police training. Given that Chauvin acted in line with his training, I don't see how this can be murder.

It wasn't protocol and he did not act in line with his training. Once again, you showcase your idiocy. You're cool with someone murdering a black man (wonder how you would feel if it was an old white man), but a woman removing a clump of cells from her body, (regardless if those clump of cells were invited to be created or not) is tantamount to murder to you and you would have her be punished as a murderer. You've got some fucked up twisted views that I can only hope you will outgrow as you get older and hopefully mature.