This is for discussions about news, politics, sports, other games, culture, philosophy etc.
Australia Kawapasaka
Lancer
Posts: 593
Location: Wales (new, south)

20 May 2019, 09:18

Image
Image
No Flag deleted_user
Gendarme
Posts: 9997

20 May 2019, 09:35

Kawapasaka wrote:Very much unintentional I imagine, but quite funny that Bran's rule is immediately corrupted by an act of nepotism allowing his sister to rule independently but presumably not the rest.


yea, that seemed super silly to me too, especially considering that Dorne didn't do the same, and didn't call for equal treatment after that. Same for the ironborn, whose sudden love and loyalty for dany seemed odd as well. but yea, best episode of the season, which says a lot, as it wasn't particularly great. Bran on the throne seems a nice twist, though it wouldve been better if more lords had staked their claim before tyrion who wasn't allowed to speak became the only one to speak lol.

ser bronn on the king's council is silly as well. meh.
No Flag deleted_user
Gendarme
Posts: 9997

20 May 2019, 09:49

Kawapasaka wrote:Anyway, I guess I'll do another thought dump about everything I didn't like.

Overarching storytelling/thematic issues:
- Why was Jon brought back from the dead again? He really didn't do anything, let alone do something that nobody else could've. This is just Melly being wrong I guess?
- Arya wants to go explore West (probably leading an innocent ship crew to certain death too, but whatever) based on one throw-away line 3 seasons ago. What happened to "the lone wolf dies, the pack survives"?
- There is still a united 7 (well, six) kingdoms... This just doesn't fit especially seeing as the North gets a special exception (more on this further down)
- Jaime "died protecting his Queen"... just terrible. This is more a problem with the previous episodes, but it's concluded here. He killed the Mad King to protect the realm, but got no recognition. Killing Cersei to protect the realm and finally being remembered for it would've been the perfect send-off.
- King Bran. Not exactly a lot of build-up for this.

Plot/logic issues:
- North gets independence, nobody else does. I think the writers have forgotten that EVERY kingdom was independent before the Targaryens. Dorne even more so, they even got to retain their prince/princess titles when eventually brought under the fold. Our """""new Prince of Dorne""""" here simply says "Aye" to being ruled by some random Northerner he's never met. Peer pressure I guess.
- Like seriously, not even the fucking Ironborn want to be independent???
- Nobody has any issues with two Starks ruling everything. And the Starks should have virtually zero power base left. The North was already weak to begin with and was devastated by four conflicts, and Winter, throughout the series. Now that Dany's army is out of the equation, our Prince of Dorne and Vale lords should have the most bargaining power here, but they don't even get to speak.
- Bronn, lord of The Reach AND master of coin. Seriously?... truly egregious fanservice. Nice to see Gendry has already settled in as a lord without any issues either.
- Incredibly lazy time-jumps.
- Thematic weather just for the sake of it. It was nice and sunny for the battle of King's Landing, then winter for one day when Dany was doing bad stuff, then nice and sunny again. Who knows what happened to the seasons.
- Who's ruling the Westerlands now? Who's been keeping them under control for so long, anyway?
- Again, everyone acting like Sansa's the most important person on the council. The North has no fucking power.
- What exactly is the point of the Night's Watch now? The White Walkers are dead, the Wildlings are friendly now, and there's a huge hole in the wall. I guess they could've just been pretending it was important to trick Grey Worm, but even amongst themselves they seem to think it still serves a purpose. Defending the realm against bad weather I guess.
- Grey Worm was irrationally and indiscriminately slaughtering prisoners of war simply because they *were* enemies of his Queen. Then someone comes and stabs his Queen. His reaction? "Hmmm, better be reasonable about this and just take him prisoner!"
- So the Unsullied just leave apparently (Also LOL at Davos suggesting a bunch of impotent men should start their own house). Now, what happened to the Dothraki (not to mention WHERE did this endless supply of troops for Dany keep coming from)? Those violent savages, now leaderless? Yeah, they would've gotten right to work raping and pillaging the countryside before looking for a way home. Might've helped the ending seem more "bittersweet" to actually have to deal with the 'too foreign' segments of Dany's invasion force realistically instead of just peacefully sending them on their way.
- "Bran would be the best king because he knows everything. No, none of the Southern lords from completely different cultures/religions are skeptical of this for even a moment. We think he'd be great!"
- Drogon really refused to kill Jon just because he was a Targ? Pretty sure past dragons had no qualms with that. Fairly certain Drogon was meant to have a pretty special bond with Dany too...
- Tyrion doesn't want to be hand (to Bran) - I think they just tacked this on because they were going for the trifecta. Jon doesn't want to rule, but he's forced to! Bran doesn't want to rule, but he's forced to! Tyrion doesn't want to rule, but he's forced to! But Tyrion actually enjoyed being hand last time, didn't he? And that was under a king he despised. But he doesn't want to serve under one he thinks will rule well? What else is he gonna do? Fuck whores until he's dead?
- Why does Brienne get a vote? There are a couple of other voting Lords here who are also just vassals of the major lords. The limitations on who is allowed to vote on this council are ridiculously ambiguous and unfair.
- Nobody is alarmed whenever Bran implies that this was all part of his plan. Do they not wonder, "gee, who else might be next on the chopping block for this spooky kid's vision of the greater good?"

Miscellaneous nitpicking:
- TRULY IT WAS A SONG OF ICE AND FIRE namedrop. I think everyone saw this coming a mile off but it still made me cringe. The real Game of Thrones was the friends we made along the way!
- Jon's LoTR send-off. There's no reason he won't see anyone ever again...
- As I said in a previous post, Edmure being brought back (where the fuck was he anyway) as a punchline. Of course he was never the most major character in the books, but it was just sad to see him turned into pure comic relief even in his first scenes back in season 3. Not even the cool sort of comic relief like Tormund, just the pathetic sort. Horrible character assassination.
- "Bran the broken"... this is not the name you want to inspire your subjects.
- "Where is Drogon?" "Uhhh, he's just gone, lol." Bit of a cop-out.



And if you want a vision of Westeros' future under this system where the King is elected but the lords electing him get to keep their own rule via lineage... look no further than the Holy Roman Empire :uglylol:
Yup, they're doomed. Historically speaking, going from an absolute to an elective monarchy can probably be considered straight-up regressive. There's just gonna be a civil war every time a king dies.



well, i think the show's ending is different from what GRRM had in mind, and so certain things the show took from the books might turn out to be dead ends on the show as they diverged from it later. (i know Jon wasn't revived in the books yet, but many clues lead to the conclusion that he probably will be as well and that this was GRRM's idea) I would've really liked to see that shot where dany walked in front of the iron throne with snow, as in the vision, although I guess it's kinda implied the moment before Jon killed her.

- Grey Worm was irrationally and indiscriminately slaughtering prisoners of war simply because they *were* enemies of his Queen. Then someone comes and stabs his Queen. His reaction? "Hmmm, better be reasonable about this and just take him prisoner!"


yea that was ridiculous, but he was never a full-fledged character, sadly. they can basically make him do whatever.

- Tyrion doesn't want to be hand (to Bran) - I think they just tacked this on because they were going for the trifecta. Jon doesn't want to rule, but he's forced to! Bran doesn't want to rule, but he's forced to! Tyrion doesn't want to rule, but he's forced to! But Tyrion actually enjoyed being hand last time, didn't he? And that was under a king he despised. But he doesn't want to serve under one he thinks will rule well? What else is he gonna do? Fuck whores until he's dead?


i dont have a problem with that, tyrion changed, and after what he saw dany do, it's not hard to believe he legit lost interest in being hand.

And if you want a vision of Westeros' future under this system where the King is elected but the lords electing him get to keep their own rule via lineage... look no further than the Holy Roman Empire :uglylol:
Yup, they're doomed. Historically speaking, going from an absolute to an elective monarchy can probably be considered straight-up regressive. There's just gonna be a civil war every time a king dies.


to be fair, most historical realms in that timeframe had some kind of elective monarchy, either choosing from members of the royal family, the major lords in the realm or the scandinavian system or even the Byzantine one. But yea, none of these were inherently much more unstable than the other ones, but it's not a weird change to make, to be honest. The fact that it probably won't work and nothing will change is not a bad thing from a storytelling perspective.
Australia Kawapasaka
Lancer
Posts: 593
Location: Wales (new, south)

20 May 2019, 13:36

Come to think of it, Bran's small council is rife with nepotism. Sam is the Grand Maester? When did he have time to master all the different areas of study at the citadel and forge his chain? He did virtually nothing there except find out who Jon is. Bronn, master of coin? How exactly has his profession of being a killer for hire qualified him for this role? I don't even see how he could be literate. Brienne is a good knight to be sure, but a good enough leader to command the Kingsguard? She's been either subservient or a complete lone wolf throughout the entire show. That leaves Davos and Tyrion, so 2/5. And Tyrion was an absolutely terrible hand for Dany and arguably not even that good under Joffrey, so even he's questionable. I'm sure Davos knows his way around boats at least though.
So much for meritocracy, these guys are just here because they knew the right people. Nothing unusual realistically of course, perhaps the showrunners were making a point that nothing has really changed, but I think I'd be giving them too much credit.

Meet the new boss... same as the old boss!
Image
User avatar
Tuvalu gibson
Gendarme
Posts: 9035
Location: USA

20 May 2019, 15:56

.
Attachments
02F910E1-272B-4490-84CD-2F178CB72C11.jpeg
02F910E1-272B-4490-84CD-2F178CB72C11.jpeg (980.77 KiB) Viewed 305 times
User avatar
Great Britain Horsemen
Lancer
Posts: 728

20 May 2019, 16:13

Kawapasaka wrote:Come to think of it, Bran's small council is rife with nepotism. Sam is the Grand Maester? When did he have time to master all the different areas of study at the citadel and forge his chain? He did virtually nothing there except find out who Jon is. Bronn, master of coin? How exactly has his profession of being a killer for hire qualified him for this role? I don't even see how he could be literate. Brienne is a good knight to be sure, but a good enough leader to command the Kingsguard? She's been either subservient or a complete lone wolf throughout the entire show. That leaves Davos and Tyrion, so 2/5. And Tyrion was an absolutely terrible hand for Dany and arguably not even that good under Joffrey, so even he's questionable. I'm sure Davos knows his way around boats at least though.
So much for meritocracy, these guys are just here because they knew the right people. Nothing unusual realistically of course, perhaps the showrunners were making a point that nothing has really changed, but I think I'd be giving them too much credit.

Meet the new boss... same as the old boss!

Bran's council is fan service galore
User avatar
Great Britain Horsemen
Lancer
Posts: 728

21 May 2019, 01:26

Image
User avatar
No Flag fightinfrenchman
Gendarme
Donator 04
Posts: 8338

21 May 2019, 01:26

Who won the Game of Thrones
There's sand in my teeth
User avatar
India rsy
Howdah
Donator 01
Posts: 1620
ESO: Rsy
Location: USA
GameRanger ID: 665696

21 May 2019, 02:23

fightinfrenchman wrote:Who won the Game of Thrones

Cripples, bastards and broken things
User avatar
United States of America XeeleeFlower
Retired Contributor
Xeelee Patron
Posts: 847

21 May 2019, 07:51



On a serious note, I absolutely love this theory:
I love good methamphetamine; highly addictive.
Australia Kawapasaka
Lancer
Posts: 593
Location: Wales (new, south)

21 May 2019, 15:02

Oh and one more thing, Jon should be absolutely livid at Sansa, she broke a sacred promise made under a heart tree which directly contributed to the mental breakdown of his waifu, forcing him to kill her. Him going into exile out of disgust due to this would've actually been "bittersweet" instead of the nonsensical Night's Watch re-establishment and tearful farewells.
Image
Italy Mosx
Dragoon
Posts: 323
ESO: Mosx themoxie
Location: Viareggio,Italy

21 May 2019, 15:15

For me it's not the end but they ll do got 9
User avatar
No Flag Djigit
Lancer
Posts: 846

21 May 2019, 15:22

fightinfrenchman wrote:Who won the Game of Thrones
Bronn
Emperor of
Image
User avatar
Netherlands edeholland
ESOC Community Team
Donator 01
Posts: 4012
ESO: edeholland
Location: the cloud
GameRanger ID: 4053888

21 May 2019, 15:41

Djigit wrote:
fightinfrenchman wrote:Who won the Game of Thrones
Bronn
I would argue Sansa or Tyrion.
Image
India Ashvin
Retired Contributor
Posts: 2076
ESO: Octanium

21 May 2019, 16:59

edeholland wrote:
Djigit wrote:
fightinfrenchman wrote:Who won the Game of Thrones
Bronn
I would argue Sansa or Tyrion.

You are confusing with Cersei and Jamie
Image
User avatar
No Flag fightinfrenchman
Gendarme
Donator 04
Posts: 8338

21 May 2019, 18:20

How is there not a clear winner
There's sand in my teeth
User avatar
No Flag fightinfrenchman
Gendarme
Donator 04
Posts: 8338

22 May 2019, 21:33

Today I found out that this show started in 2011 and I am utterly shocked. How did time move so fast
There's sand in my teeth
User avatar
United States of America n0el
ESOC Business Team
Posts: 3666
ESO: n0eL

22 May 2019, 21:49

Djigit wrote:
fightinfrenchman wrote:Who won the Game of Thrones
Bronn

definite winner. cant even argue tbh.
SirCallen wrote:Just drink the beer as it is, you hipsters.
User avatar
Brazil lemmings121
Jaeger
Posts: 2182
ESO: lemmings121

27 May 2019, 19:58

Djigit wrote:
fightinfrenchman wrote:Who won the Game of Thrones
Bronn


i'm so angry with the show.
Italy Mosx
Dragoon
Posts: 323
ESO: Mosx themoxie
Location: Viareggio,Italy

28 May 2019, 12:39

I'm. Waiting for a Cinematic saga
User avatar
Tuvalu gibson
Gendarme
Posts: 9035
Location: USA

30 Oct 2019, 04:35

Honestly this is what I needed today
Attachments
C75EAAF7-5398-4E82-BC37-C01652D4A642.png
C75EAAF7-5398-4E82-BC37-C01652D4A642.png (4.67 MiB) Viewed 74 times
User avatar
United States of America n0el
ESOC Business Team
Posts: 3666
ESO: n0eL

30 Oct 2019, 12:22

Glad there’s a lot of source material here.
SirCallen wrote:Just drink the beer as it is, you hipsters.
User avatar
Great Britain Horsemen
Lancer
Posts: 728

31 Oct 2019, 03:15

[url][/url]
gibson wrote:Honestly this is what I needed today

http://houseofthedragon.co.uk/
User avatar
Tuvalu gibson
Gendarme
Posts: 9035
Location: USA

31 Oct 2019, 03:26

n0el wrote:Glad there’s a lot of source material here.

GRRM is involved and D&D arent so it should be fine.
Australia Kawapasaka
Lancer
Posts: 593
Location: Wales (new, south)

31 Oct 2019, 06:20

Didn't they have 2 prequels planned or something?
Image

Forum Info

Return to “Real-life Discussion”



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest