Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

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United States of America Metis
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Metis »

I foresee, in the not too far distant future, that a driver will turn onto a freeway ramp and then the car's computer will take over to merge the vehicle into traffic by communicating its needs with the freeway traffic, which will calculate when and at what speed the car will merge and create an appropriate space. The freeway travel will essentially be hands off until the driver is merged off at his programmed exit ramp, after which he will take over for city driving. This is pretty much what commercial aircraft can do now. I once had the opportunity to "co-pilot" a Cessna Citation. I was amazed that those jets could not only fly 95% of the flight under autopilot, being directed to the next airport by programming and control signals, they also could be auto-landed.
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by momuuu »

Its probably possible to drive on a highway at very high speeds without keeping proper distance if it all gets automated. If the car ahead of your car will brake, your car can practically instantly become aware of that and brake accordingly. Future traffic is probably going to be truly amazing.
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Jaeger »

I didn't finish reading the whole article yet, but so far in the article nobody mentioned that even if you buy a car, you might have a higher chance as being one of the 10 pedestrians rather than the driver.
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United States of America Metis
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Metis »

jerom wrote:Future traffic is probably going to be truly amazing.
It should be safer for road workers and emergency personnel too. Even though the fines are doubled in construction zones people still barrel through them at normal highway speeds. With programmable cars this could be prevented.

Of course, police may not like this as they tend to use traffic violations (sometimes bogus ones) as an excuse to stop motorists so that they can search them for drugs, etc. in hopes of making an arrest.
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No Flag Good ol Ivan
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Good ol Ivan »

krichk wrote:
ivan wrote:What makes you think so? Have you ever driven a car anyway?

Actually I read about it on the French Wikipedia page about braking distance just before posting, its a study published by Renault (and obviously a formula 1 brakes more efficiently than a regular car, you think the average Mini Cooper has better brakes than a formula1???)
And yes I drive, no my car doesnt stop instantaneously, and its common knowledge that braking distances are something to take into account when you drive.
But I guess you know that and youre just exagerating things a bit and I shouldnt be so aggressive when explaining my thoughts but hey :P
I didnt find you particularly agressive, and to be honest Im not exaggerating either.
Yeah you have to take braking distances when you drive, but the few times I got to drive modern cars I did find the anti tracing system very efficient and even unnatural, as the car could indeed stop pretty quickly compared to my old car.
United States of America Metis
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Metis »

The main thing I don't like about these new stability control systems is when you are driving on ice and the vehicle thinks that it should keep going in order to maintain traction when you are furiously trying to stop because there is something in front of you.
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Sgt_ROFLCopter »

Most of the programming involved in Autonomous Vehicles is much higher level than what you guys have described. Most of the programming is created by Supervised Machine Learning. This involves either describing the goals as a list of quantifiable rules or providing a massive number of great examples to something called an "Artificial Neural Network" and then allowing it to evolve a randomly formed mathematical algorithm until it can successfully respond to all or most situations that you have provided it to learn from.

In practice, the autonomous car companies can make simulations of traffic conditions and then attempt to train an optimal driving algorithm based on some scoring system inside that simulation. Inside of a real life vehicle, the previously simulated information would be provided as input from image recognition algorithms and things of a similar nature. Nobody would be solving the famous trolley problem, but they would provide the score card that would allow an AI to make the trolley problem decision.
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Metis »

Even though I am a scientist, the idea of a self programming artificial neural network makes me want to say "Damn, science, you scary!"

[video src="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otyTzf4hJJs"][/video]
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Sgt_ROFLCopter »

A more appropriate name would be Simulated Neural Networks' it's just a solution finding algorithm based on the mathematical representations of how neurons turn each other on and off. People call them "Black Box Equations" sometimes because although what you put in and what you get out looks right, you have no idea what the actual underlying mathematical solution is. Fortunately, the solution finding algorithm is a fairly simple iterative schema that can be legibly programmed in about 11 lines using MatLab, Python, or any other vectorized programming language.
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by iNcog »

-- deleted post --

Reason: on request (off-topic bulk delete)
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/incog_aoe
Garja wrote: ↑
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by momuuu »

ivan wrote:
krichk wrote:Actually I read about it on the French Wikipedia page about braking distance just before posting, its a study published by Renault (and obviously a formula 1 brakes more efficiently than a regular car, you think the average Mini Cooper has better brakes than a formula1???)
And yes I drive, no my car doesnt stop instantaneously, and its common knowledge that braking distances are something to take into account when you drive.
But I guess you know that and youre just exagerating things a bit and I shouldnt be so aggressive when explaining my thoughts but hey :P
I didnt find you particularly agressive, and to be honest Im not exaggerating either.
Yeah you have to take braking distances when you drive, but the few times I got to drive modern cars I did find the anti tracing system very efficient and even unnatural, as the car could indeed stop pretty quickly compared to my old car.
Its just that you have to get used to it. Occasionally I retune the brakes on my bike and experience about the same feeling. Doesnt mean there isnt any braking distance anymore though. At 120 kmph youre going ~33 meters per second. If you react in about a second youll have travelled 33 meters, thats quite a lot. Not to mention that breaking in 1 second at that speed is probably lethal for you as driver.
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Jam »

incog wrote:This is why the faster you go, the more you need to look ahead.

I never drive fast if I can''t actually see the road ahead, even if I know it well. In small French roads, I could have already killed a few people had I been driving 20-30 km/h faster.

Eyes on the road, always.
This just happened to me yesterday, and it pisses me off. I was driving at the 50km/h limit on a residential and this mother was playing catch the football with her two sons on the patch of grass between the road and the sidewalk, even though it''s literally a minute walk to two different parks. I soon as I saw the way the ball bounced I braked and moved toward the centre of the road and sure enough the ball bounced into the road and the kid followed. If I wasn''t paying attention or speeding I wouldn''t have reacted in time. This makes me so mad. This is why I only speed on the highway.
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Sgt_ROFLCopter »

jam wrote:
incog wrote:This is why the faster you go, the more you need to look ahead.

I never drive fast if I cant actually see the road ahead, even if I know it well. In small French roads, I could have already killed a few people had I been driving 20-30 km/h faster.

Eyes on the road, always.
This just happened to me yesterday, and it pisses me off. I was driving at the 50km/h limit on a residential and this mother was playing catch the football with her two sons on the patch of grass between the road and the sidewalk, even though its literally a minute walk to two different parks. I soon as I saw the way the ball bounced I braked and moved toward the centre of the road and sure enough the ball bounced into the road and the kid followed. If I wasnt paying attention or speeding I wouldnt have reacted in time. This makes me so mad. This is why I only speed on the highway.
Try living near a University where every night the streets are packed with wandering drunken students. On a similar note, I once saw a homeless dude skateboarding in the left lane of the freeway. He was doing like 15 tops in a 65.
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by iNcog »

-- deleted post --

Reason: on request (off-topic bulk delete)
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/incog_aoe
Garja wrote: ↑
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Mr. Pecksniff »

incog wrote:15 mph???

on a skateboard? sounds dangerous
I see people here whizzing around at 30mph on rollerskates.
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by momuuu »

I love biking at 40 kmph through urban areas. It feels dangerous and unsafe but it's legal. Taking over cars and stuff :p
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Mr. Pecksniff »

jerom wrote:I love biking at 40 kmph through urban areas. It feels dangerous and unsafe but it''s legal. Taking over cars and stuff :p
Damn son, you ought to contain yourself.
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Jam »

jerom wrote:I love biking at 40 kmph through urban areas. It feels dangerous and unsafe but it''s legal. Taking over cars and stuff :p
Do you take over the cars electronically, or you do ride up beside them, jump through the passenger window and overpower the driver?
United States of America Metis
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by Metis »

jerom wrote:I love biking at 40 kmph through urban areas. It feels dangerous and unsafe but it''s legal. Taking over cars and stuff :p
I used to ride motorcycles a lot. Because two-wheeled vehicles become more stable with speed, at 75 mph you feel completely safe on a motorcycle, even though in reality you may be teetering on the brink of death at any time.
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Programming autonomous vehicles to kill

Post by benj89 »

for some reason being a passenger on a motorcycle is one of the most frustrating thing I have experienced. Even on a decent sized 650cm3, without backseat your arms are constantly tight which is demanding on a long ride, and you don't control any mistake that will surely kill you. Hate it
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