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United States of America Metis
Howdah
Posts: 1661

07 Nov 2015, 08:00

I think that these animals are actually aware that they are communicating, what do you think?

[video src="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmeUSSEaxfQ"][/video]

[video src="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdEtn7ekOsE"][/video]
[video src="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gvgkHSyKFE"][/video]
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No Flag howlingwolfpaw
Howdah
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07 Nov 2015, 09:42

I think many animals are very intelligent and have an awareness beyond ours. Grouping extreme sensitivities of smell and hearing as specialized intelligence. Animals have many forms of communication
Netherlands momuuu
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07 Nov 2015, 16:25

howlingwolfpaw wrote:I think many animals are very intelligent and have an awareness beyond ours. Grouping extreme sensitivities of smell and hearing as specialized intelligence. Animals have many forms of communication
So you are suggesting I should try to let animals do my homework?
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No Flag fightinfrenchman
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07 Nov 2015, 16:46

It's crazy how smart some birds are.
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United States of America evilcheadar
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07 Nov 2015, 16:51

I have an oscar fish in my aquarium, who is supposed to be smart, but sometimes just bashes around the aquarium like a goober and cuts it's head.
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United States of America Metis
Howdah
Posts: 1661

07 Nov 2015, 17:09

evilcheadar wrote:I have an oscar fish in my aquarium
It only takes salmon fry about a week before they are following you around wanting you to feed them. When we raised sturgeon they would come up to the surface to get their heads scratched.
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No Flag fightinfrenchman
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07 Nov 2015, 17:17

metis wrote:
evilcheadar wrote:I have an oscar fish in my aquarium
It only takes salmon fry about a week before they are following you around wanting you to feed them. When we raised sturgeon they would come up to the surface to get their heads scratched.



Do you think Koko the gorilla can actually communicate? Some people are skeptical and say that her trainer is faking a lot of it through "interpretation".
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United States of America Metis
Howdah
Posts: 1661

07 Nov 2015, 18:11

fightinfrenchman wrote:
metis wrote:

Do you think Koko the gorilla can actually communicate? Some people are skeptical and say that her trainer is faking a lot of it through "interpretation".
Mothers of children with severe autism sometimes think that if they help guide their hands then the children can communicate with them by pointing to certain words or shapes. However, what is probably happening is that the mother is unconsciously pointing herself. This is the same reason that Ouija boards sometimes work. It could well be that Kokos trainers are just talking to themselves by sending unconscious signals that the gorilla picks up on. The way to test this would be to devise a scenario where the ape had to communicate its wishes when it was completely alone and not being spoken to. Even speech can send subtle clues as to the desire of the speaker through unconscious inflection and emphasis on certain words.
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No Flag howlingwolfpaw
Howdah
Posts: 1888

07 Nov 2015, 19:05

jerom wrote:
howlingwolfpaw wrote:I think many animals are very intelligent and have an awareness beyond ours. Grouping extreme sensitivities of smell and hearing as specialized intelligence. Animals have many forms of communication
So you are suggesting I should try to let animals do my homework?

are you saying you think an animal would do better at your homework? If you need help you could at least try teaching it to an animal, it may not learn it the way you think but in teaching it would help you learn it.

hmmm... but thats pretty silly and missing the point of what I said. Intelligence is a perceptual thing and there are multiple types of intelligence. A dogs ability to sniff out one scent among many is sort of like smell intelligence, you can even train a dog to look for particular scents making it a form of intelligence. crows for instance can solve complex problems. Raccoon can be very tricky as well. they say an elephant never forgets a person.... so many more examples I could give of the intelligence of animals.
United States of America Metis
Howdah
Posts: 1661

07 Nov 2015, 19:54

howlingwolfpaw wrote:
jerom wrote:So you are suggesting I should try to let animals do my homework?
Raccoon can be very tricky as well.
Those damn raccoons can nearly outsmart humans where getting into our food is concerned. Ive watched them run to the end of the dock, jump into the boat, pull up the fish basket by its rope, unlatch the gate, and then take out a fish. Ive also seen them untwist wires to open garbage can lids and unlatch ice chests. About the only thing they cant yet figure out is padlocks.
No Flag Mr. Pecksniff
Howdah
Posts: 1648

07 Nov 2015, 20:09

Honey badgers are pretty smaht as well tbqh.
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France iNcog
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07 Nov 2015, 20:43

metis wrote:
howlingwolfpaw wrote: Raccoon can be very tricky as well.
Those damn raccoons can nearly outsmart humans where getting into our food is concerned. Ive watched them run to the end of the dock, jump into the boat, pull up the fish basket by its rope, unlatch the gate, and then take out a fish. Ive also seen them untwist wires to open garbage can lids and unlatch ice chests. About the only thing they cant yet figure out is padlocks.




Try putting a few keys next to it, who knows.
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United States of America Metis
Howdah
Posts: 1661

08 Nov 2015, 09:47

Pretty smart rats.


[video src="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LMgkGesoVI"][/video]
No Flag musketjr
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Posts: 624

08 Nov 2015, 13:08

^ that's a pretty awesome vid. I watched a couple more from her channel, impressive stuff
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France iNcog
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08 Nov 2015, 13:25

metis wrote:Pretty smart rats.


[video src="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LMgkGesoVI"][/video]


my fucking face when rats can read
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Netherlands momuuu
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08 Nov 2015, 17:50

howlingwolfpaw wrote:
jerom wrote:So you are suggesting I should try to let animals do my homework?
are you saying you think an animal would do better at your homework? If you need help you could at least try teaching it to an animal, it may not learn it the way you think but in teaching it would help you learn it.

hmmm... but thats pretty silly and missing the point of what I said. Intelligence is a perceptual thing and there are multiple types of intelligence. A dogs ability to sniff out one scent among many is sort of like smell intelligence, you can even train a dog to look for particular scents making it a form of intelligence. crows for instance can solve complex problems. Raccoon can be very tricky as well. they say an elephant never forgets a person.... so many more examples I could give of the intelligence of animals.

Smelling is not intelligence lol. Smelling is just an ability of the nose, and dogs smell better because their nose is more developed than ours. I dont think any animal can touch a human in any intelligence based task. And then I dont want you to compare some of the dumbest humans to the smartest animals. Just take an average and realize that humans are superior.
No Flag stevelance
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Posts: 56

08 Nov 2015, 18:06

I could easily do all of this, animals are not that smart.
United States of America Metis
Howdah
Posts: 1661

08 Nov 2015, 18:14

[quote="stevelance"][/quote]The point is not that humans can do things that non-human animals can do, it''s that these animals can do many things that we once thought only we were capable of, which shows that they are not just the non-thinking wind-up toys that Descartes and others thought they were.
No Flag stevelance
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08 Nov 2015, 18:19

metis wrote:
stevelance wrote:
The point is not that humans can do things that non-human animals?can do, its?that these?animals?can?do many things that we once thought?only we were capable of, which shows that they are not just the non-thinking wind-up toys that Descartes and others thought they were.


Yes they are smarter than a brick, but they are still not nearly as smart as some of my dumb classmates. So overall these animals probably shouldnt be referred to as smart.
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No Flag howlingwolfpaw
Howdah
Posts: 1888

09 Nov 2015, 00:26

of course humans are superior but that does not mean that they are not intelligent. Our intelligence is linked to our awareness, and specialized highly sensitive awareness leads to a better understanding and ability to learn. There are many forms of intelligence, that's why some people are book smart and others street smart, some highly creative, others very analytical. The OP was asking if animals have the awareness to communicate, and they do, and sense the feelings of people. Many birds are thought to have the intelligence of a 5 year old. No one has created a scale of intelligence as to what it is, to an advanced alien species they might consider themselves intelligent and people like how humans consider animals unintelligent. THat would not mean humans do not have intelligence, just not super intellect. Its all about perspective and relativity.
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Romania Dolan
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09 Nov 2015, 01:40

metis wrote:Pretty smart rats.


[video src="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LMgkGesoVI"][/video]
Most of this stuff is operant conditioning.
Of course, nobody is denying that many species can learn from their experiences' after all they do have a hippocampus and quite similar basic brain structure.

They still lack a self, they don''t develop complex societies, don''t have articulate language (no developed Broca''s area), they can''t pass the false belief test, their neocortex ratio is much smaller than a human''s.

And they don''t have football. So, they''re really backwards.
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No Flag howlingwolfpaw
Howdah
Posts: 1888

09 Nov 2015, 03:27

the ability to learn is in part what defines intelligence. animals do have their own hierarchical social structure for most species. Animals can communicate with echother and other animals. dont understimate them
United States of America Metis
Howdah
Posts: 1661

09 Nov 2015, 04:47

@Dolan

A lot of human training is operant conditioning too. If you've ever been on a sports team or in the military you know that in training if you did the right thing you got an "attaboy" and if you did the wrong thing you got your ass chewed. If this isn't operant conditioning I don't know what is.
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No Flag howlingwolfpaw
Howdah
Posts: 1888

09 Nov 2015, 06:27

very good point metis factors like that brought us up from birth
United States of America Metis
Howdah
Posts: 1661

09 Nov 2015, 07:04

A wild bird that knows how to get humans to provide it food and drink. Who is training whom here?

[video src="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYwRMEomJMM"][/video]

I would say that a lot of humans couldn't figure this out.

[video src="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZerUbHmuY04"][/video]

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