ESOC Patch 7.0.0.0 released!

[fightinfrenchman]

ESOC Patch 8 should include the Egyptian God Cards as Age 4 shipments

[Davy_Jones_123]

Good bye EP 7. China is ruined, I won't play.

[harcha]

Good bye EP 7. China is ruined, I won't play.

ruined? how?

[Davy_Jones_123]

I'm dissapointed with this EP. I think this is going a bit far from the original patch. Since most of the players on ESO are using RE and when they watch the tournament videos, they won't understand the game if you put changes like you did for China. 200w start, 5% hp buff, like wtf? Having only 1 shipment in age 2 just suck and you can't deal with civ like russia and india if they rush. Keshik and Steppe don't do shit against them .

[EAGLEMUT]

Since most of the players on ESO are using RE and when they watch the tournament videos, they won't understand the game if you put changes like you did for China.

RE and ESO will most likely be obsolete by the end of this year, so it doesn't matter.

[princeofcarthage]

Since most of the players on ESO are using RE and when they watch the tournament videos, they won't understand the game if you put changes like you did for China.

RE and ESO will most likely be obsolete by the end of this year, so it doesn't matter.

That would also probably mean EP being obsolete. In that case why push for such controversial changes rather than making somewhat needed changes to already largely accepted EP6 Patch

[EAGLEMUT]

Since most of the players on ESO are using RE and when they watch the tournament videos, they won't understand the game if you put changes like you did for China.

RE and ESO will most likely be obsolete by the end of this year, so it doesn't matter.

That would also probably mean EP being obsolete.

On the contrary. Judging by community patches going into the other Age titles, it could mean EP changes will be integrated to some extent.

[princeofcarthage]

Fair enuf

[harcha]

I'm dissapointed with this EP. I think this is going a bit far from the original patch. Since most of the players on ESO are using RE and when they watch the tournament videos, they won't understand the game if you put changes like you did for China. 200w start, 5% hp buff, like wtf? Having only 1 shipment in age 2 just suck and you can't deal with civ like russia and india if they rush. Keshik and Steppe don't do shit against them .

I see your problem. Have you tried ff?

[Aizamk]

Show hidden quotes

Since most of the players on ESO are using RE and when they watch the tournament videos, they won't understand the game if you put changes like you did for China.

RE and ESO will most likely be obsolete by the end of this year, so it doesn't matter.

That would also probably mean EP being obsolete.

On the contrary. Judging by community patches going into the other Age titles, it could mean EP changes will be integrated to some extent.

This is one of the worries I have about DE. Is working on a UI 3.0 worth the hours if there’s going to be a native UI? And if there is no native UI, 2.2 would still work, with a bit of correcting. But 3.0? Probably not.

[EAGLEMUT]

Show hidden quotes

Since most of the players on ESO are using RE and when they watch the tournament videos, they won't understand the game if you put changes like you did for China.

RE and ESO will most likely be obsolete by the end of this year, so it doesn't matter.

That would also probably mean EP being obsolete.

On the contrary. Judging by community patches going into the other Age titles, it could mean EP changes will be integrated to some extent.

This is one of the worries I have about DE. Is working on a UI 3.0 worth the hours if there’s going to be a native UI? And if there is no native UI, 2.2 would still work, with a bit of correcting. But 3.0? Probably not.

Yeah, I have to agree. At this point, the only realistic use case for UI3 would be if DE flops and community keeps playing EP over GR or something. Which is a possibility, but not too likely.

[lordraphael]

from what ive seen at aoe 2 DE the UI is pretty bad. A lot worse than the modded UI used for aoe 2.

[Goodspeed]

The caster UI in AoE2 was pretty amazing (https://captureage.com/), that was hard to beat for DE. They could've tried a little harder though...
Regardless, the old UI can't be used with DE so it dies with voobly. Whether voobly will die is still up in the air but it does seem likely at this point.

[RefluxSemantic]

Show hidden quotes

Since most of the players on ESO are using RE and when they watch the tournament videos, they won't understand the game if you put changes like you did for China.

RE and ESO will most likely be obsolete by the end of this year, so it doesn't matter.

That would also probably mean EP being obsolete.

On the contrary. Judging by community patches going into the other Age titles, it could mean EP changes will be integrated to some extent.

Which is why these changes are even more damaging than they appear to be on the surface.

[deleted_user]

Except they aren't damaging.

[zoom]

I'm dissapointed with this EP. I think this is going a bit far from the original patch. Since most of the players on ESO are using RE and when they watch the tournament videos, they won't understand the game if you put changes like you did for China. 200w start, 5% hp buff, like wtf? Having only 1 shipment in age 2 just suck and you can't deal with civ like russia and india if they rush. Keshik and Steppe don't do shit against them .

Although it is true that some players seemingly struggle to understand how starting crates work (despite my best and repeated attempts to explain the facts), the benefit to balance is well worth the initial misunderstanding, in this case:

Currently, depending entirely on the crate start, Chinese can be up (or down) 100 resources—a 200 resource swing. Necessarily, this is a major balance issue for the civilization, making it impossible to balance.

Instead of unpredictably varying wildly, the civilization's relative strength is now largely consistent, between games, which means it is no longer impossible to remotely balance. Thanks to the recent Village cost buff, the worst case scenario means gathering merely 20w more than you would have to, on RE, to build two Villages.

The popular and sensible British Allies nerf seems easy enough to understand, though. Ultimately, you'll be pleased to learn that top players consider Chinese favored against both Indians and Russians.

With that said, if players eventually find the civilization to be weak – like you seem to assume it to be – it will be buffed.

[zoom]

Show hidden quotes

Since most of the players on ESO are using RE and when they watch the tournament videos, they won't understand the game if you put changes like you did for China.

RE and ESO will most likely be obsolete by the end of this year, so it doesn't matter.

That would also probably mean EP being obsolete.

On the contrary. Judging by community patches going into the other Age titles, it could mean EP changes will be integrated to some extent.

Which is why these changes are even more damaging than they appear to be on the surface.

Imagine the irreparable damage if someone actually shipped 6 Coyote Runners!

[Cometk]

Show hidden quotes

Since most of the players on ESO are using RE and when they watch the tournament videos, they won't understand the game if you put changes like you did for China.

RE and ESO will most likely be obsolete by the end of this year, so it doesn't matter.

That would also probably mean EP being obsolete.

On the contrary. Judging by community patches going into the other Age titles, it could mean EP changes will be integrated to some extent.

Which is why these changes are even more damaging than they appear to be on the surface.

pretty much the sole reason you have some folks crying about ep is because it’s too different from re

they forget re is garbage balance-wise and riddled with bugs

[RefluxSemantic]

Show hidden quotes

Since most of the players on ESO are using RE and when they watch the tournament videos, they won't understand the game if you put changes like you did for China.

RE and ESO will most likely be obsolete by the end of this year, so it doesn't matter.

That would also probably mean EP being obsolete.

On the contrary. Judging by community patches going into the other Age titles, it could mean EP changes will be integrated to some extent.

Which is why these changes are even more damaging than they appear to be on the surface.

pretty much the sole reason you have some folks crying about ep is because it’s too different from re

they forget re is garbage balance-wise and riddled with bugs

But maybe they just consider re great gameplay-wise? Because that's my opinion. In terms of gameplay RE is a well tested, professionally developed product and I think that shows. Balance wise it is half assed or straight up shit, but gameplay wise it's very good in my opinion. I'd be inclined to argue ep is mostly the opposite; after lots of trial and error the balance is okay and the gameplay changes are nowhere near the quality level of RE.

[Cometk]

Okay

[princeofcarthage]

You know you make zero sense when cometk gives zero fucks about your arguements

[flontier]

The more you still close to RE, the less you will attract new players or make old players come back.
AOE3 have bad reputation, you have to prove it has changed will REAL change to make people mind different about the game and give it a try.

Its very sad for the success of aoe3DE if we stay too close to REshit just for the confort of few players that doesnt want all of their knowledge about strategies lost and having to re-adapt cause they have no brain.

[RefluxSemantic]

Aoe3's bad reputation has nothing to do with the gameplay though. Complaints are mostly about the homecity levelling bullshit, to some extend the eso environment and about the bad balance. And this bad balance doesnt even refer to RE level bad, but to what aoe3 was at launch.

Im also not arguing to not do balancing. I'm saying that the ep 'team' doesnt have the resources or qualifications to do major redesigning, but despite that 'they' keep trying to do so and in my eyes making the gameplay worse by doing so.

[RefluxSemantic]

To be more precise I oppose or strongly dislike:

- the effect most esoc maps have on gameplay. Mapscrews suck, but every civ having 3+ safe hunts and 2+ safe mines makes the game boring as fuck.

- the redesign of sioux. Sioux is an abomination on ep and the one thing that made them really fun and unique and made me want to play them, raiding and running around with bow riders, was nerfed very hard

- the india redesign. Sepoy rushes were one of my favorite strategies in the game. It was one of the only strategies where you could rush without being pretty all in or low on eco. While a sepoy nerf may have been warranted, nerfing hp to the point where a TC 2 shots a sepoy killed one of the most unique and fun (imo) strategies in the game while giving back nothing.

- the attempts to 'fix' spain. Spain's RE gameplay is very unique and there is no civ like it. Instead of slightly buffing their main strategy to make up for the fact that they were to weak, EP seems to want to turn them into a generic eco FF civ. I dislike that. More than half of the civs already play a generic FF style, let Spain be unique and actually be good at that.

- The attempts to make Otto more generic. Otto is one of the few civs that has to rely on very strong units and a strong start to remain competitive. This is a unique niche that they have. All changes to Otto have mostly diminished this. I liked playing as Otto knowing that I was on a bit of a timer and I likes playing against them knowing that they were on a timer. I dislike how EP has reduces this unique aspect of otto.

- I actually dislike how EP nerfed the only two real FI strats in the game into the ground. Japan FI was pretty unique on RE and quite possibly my favorite strat of all time. Its dead on EP. China Old han was one of my favorite things to pull off. Its also dead on EP.

- I strongly dislike what was done to china banner armies. China was fine the way they were. It was unique and fun to be limited like they were. I dont even understand why this was changed.

Overall I think I oppose every single design change. I dont think they are well thought out and I especially dont think they are well tested. These huge changes require hundreds to thousands of manhours to test. You need to continuously iterate and wonder if it is more fun. They surely did that for RE, considering that a professional team was working full time on that. They surely dont do that for EP, where Zoi theorycrafts some changes and then implements them without testing (oh, and neither does he have any experience with game development, unlike the guys that created aoe3).

[Davy_Jones_123]

I'm dissapointed with this EP. I think this is going a bit far from the original patch. Since most of the players on ESO are using RE and when they watch the tournament videos, they won't understand the game if you put changes like you did for China. 200w start, 5% hp buff, like wtf? Having only 1 shipment in age 2 just suck and you can't deal with civ like russia and india if they rush. Keshik and Steppe don't do shit against them .

I see your problem. Have you tried ff?

You don't ff vs Russia or Inida. Even if you build a TP in transition, they still get the map control and destroy the TP after a few mins and there's nothing you can do about it.