3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by Cleters »

Yup, that's 2 different game.
I'm top 15 in team right now, and I almost nevet get out from top 25-30 since the launch of DE.

Still, I never made better than top 110 in 1v1 (I started 1v1 on DE), and I think I should be between 150-180.
That's not only about mechanics or else, that's a lot about strategy to me. There's a lot of 1v1 players that are totally OP with a good strat they know by heart, but that just can't work in team. Like all the players that mastered spain or germany. They could feel totally lost in teamgames.

On the other way around, there's a lot of very good players in team that lack mixing units or using artillery for exemple because they use to have mates to complement their army, so they don't do so well in 1v1.



+ we are a small community, people are used to how others play. If you played the same dude 100 times, you know what to do or not to do. When you go in team or 1v1 then, you play vs new people and you have no clue about what they're going to do.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by [Armag] diarouga »

gibson wrote:
[Armag] diarouga wrote:
Kyo_ wrote:1v1s 2v2s and 3v3s are very different games. Being good in 1v1 doesn't guarantee being good in 3v3, and vice versa. I've consistently lost to pr 20s in 1v1, but have also consistently beaten pr 40s in 3v3s. That being said, it is funny how the weaker captains keep winning their games. The balance system in this tournament is glaringly flawed. I hope they don't allow players below pr 28-29 in the next tournament.
There is no way you can lose to pr20 in 1v1 and beat pr40 consistently with balanced teams in 3v3.
Its not that extreme, but there is a point there. For example when I was playing team actively I never felt outclassed by higher ranked 1v1 players. The difference between a pr30 team player and a pr40 1v1 player can often be negligible in a 3v3 and even 2v2 depending on a few different circumstances.
Ye, there's up to 5pr difference between 1v1 and team, so if you're playing with a 1v1 player who doesn't have a lot of experience in team (ie pr35ish in team), the difference is not massive, only 3-5 pr. But then it's because the guy is pr35 in team, and you don't lose to pr20.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by [Armag] diarouga »

Yup, that's 2 different game.
I'm top 15 in team right now, and I almost nevet get out from top 25-30 since the launch of DE.
I don't think it makes a lot of sense to talk about "top X" in team, because it depends too much on activity.
I've played with you, and you're a good player, but there are many 1v1 players who're very good at team and don't play team on DE. If we were to host a major team tournament you'd probably be something like top30.
Still, I never made better than top 110 in 1v1 (I started 1v1 on DE), and I think I should be between 150-180.
Yes, and that's like major or lieutenant colonel. You're telling me that you're colonel in team and pr30ish in 1v1, that's a 5pr difference, not a 20 pr difference.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by JKProwler »

Isn't this tourney based on drafting?

I think the team that practices together more will have a better chance when ur most likely playing with players that u haven't played with before

Three pr 28 players if they play together more could prob beat pr 40 with 2 pr28
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by chronique »

Also a lot of 1v1 players, when they play team, don't play for their rank and play chill with chill civ. I don't think 3 pr 40 1v1 with low civ are better than a team of lakota/japan/sweden pr 25 which know the current 3v3 meta. If for an obscure reason, i would sign up for 3v3 tourney, you can be sure i will learn other civ than spain/haude.

3v3 seem more lame than 1v1 based on my current 20 3v3 game played.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

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Post by gibson »

Diarouga is right, talking about top x in team doesn’t really mean anything. Being top 20 in team can just mean that you play 3v3 with 2 mates and are willing to wait 7 minutes to get 5 elo bashing noobs and do that over and over again. The top 100 is riddled with over ranked players who do that and are an ez bash via queue snipe when one is streaming.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by [Armag] diarouga »

Ye also this. If you team with good mates you'll almost never lose a game.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by princeofkabul »

so many clueless players making their own baseless conclusions.
I don't think 3 pr 40 1v1 with low civ are better than a team of lakota/japan/sweden pr 25 which know the current 3v3 meta.
3 pr 40's would priest bumrush the 25's after a bottle of whisky and end up victorious.

and this...
Three pr 28 players if they play together more could prob beat pr 40 with 2 pr28
okay then
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by [Armag] diarouga »

Yes, 3 pr40 would of course stomp 3 pr25. At pr25, people mismacro and don't get constant unit batch, and they don't really micro.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by princeofkabul »

Could always try it. Me, knush, and aiz are and have been roughly around 39-41 for years now. against 3 liets playing whatever they want. and we can 3x spain. Such an even game that'd be.

Or if talking about purely 1v1ers from brig to MG

Put up Soldier, diarouga and miggo against these liets.

The result would be exactly the same.

messaged edit for small "d".
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by [Armag] diarouga »

Ye can do that. Soldier, miggo and me with triple Spain vs pr25. Pretty sure we'd win.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by Cleters »

chronique wrote:
3v3 seem more lame than 1v1 based on my current 20 3v3 game played.
haha Idk, I think it's a matter of POV, from my side I find 1v1 players laming more. 90% of my games are vs lakota, jap or spain ff spaming card with 0 macro. x)
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by Hazza54321 »

no way can 3 pr29s beat 2 pr28 + pr40, the pr40 could almost 1v2 in a 3v3 setting
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by gibson »

Hazza54321 wrote:no way can 3 pr29s beat 2 pr28 + pr40, the pr40 could almost 1v2 in a 3v3 setting
Jailed tournament finals would beg to differ, also that’s just not right, I feel confident that I could hold my own vs a pr40 with a 10 percent handicap and 2 of me would shit on anyone easily.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by chronique »

pr 25 team play mean nothing then because i watched team game back in the past and pr 25 in 3v3 was far far better than pr 25 in 1v1, not even close, maybe because most of their game are unrated.

I was pr 38-39 when i switch in team game in 2012 and it took me 6 month to hit a sort of decent level in 3v3 (not equal, probably lt co level), and that's was before the team QS which increase more the difference between 1v1 player and 3v3 (because without laming in 3v3 it's pretty much impossible to be top ladder).

Full 1v1 player are absolutly lost in 3v3, i know what i am talking about, most of team game i played on DE was with other 1v1 players and i never reach the top 100 in team game
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by princeofkabul »

chronique wrote:pr 25 team play mean nothing then because i watched team game back in the past and pr 25 in 3v3 was far far better than pr 25 in 1v1, not even close, maybe because most of their game are unrated.

I was pr 38-39 when i switch in team game in 2012 and it took me 6 month to hit a sort of decent level in 3v3 (not equal, probably lt co level), and that's was before the team QS which increase more the difference between 1v1 player and 3v3 (because without laming in 3v3 it's pretty much impossible to be top ladder).

Full 1v1 player are absolutly lost in 3v3, , most of team game i played on DE was with other 1v1 players and i never reach the top 100 in team game
i know what i am talking about

except you don't
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

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Post by knusch »

seems like i dodged a bullet here xD
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by flontier »

chronique wrote:pr 25 team play mean nothing then because i watched team game back in the past and pr 25 in 3v3 was far far better than pr 25 in 1v1, not even close, maybe because most of their game are unrated.

I was pr 38-39 when i switch in team game in 2012 and it took me 6 month to hit a sort of decent level in 3v3 (not equal, probably lt co level), and that's was before the team QS which increase more the difference between 1v1 player and 3v3 (because without laming in 3v3 it's pretty much impossible to be top ladder).

Full 1v1 player are absolutly lost in 3v3, i know what i am talking about, most of team game i played on DE was with other 1v1 players and i never reach the top 100 in team game
Only true with full 1v1 one civ bot player who get totally lost in other game modes when you need to exploit a bit more than 10% of the game :p
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by princeofkabul »

so 2 gibsons with 10 % handicap would absolutely annihilate two top of the food chain teamplayers. interesting.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by [Armag] diarouga »

That would be interesting, I think it could be pretty close.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by princeofkabul »

I don't think so
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by chronique »

flontier wrote:
chronique wrote:pr 25 team play mean nothing then because i watched team game back in the past and pr 25 in 3v3 was far far better than pr 25 in 1v1, not even close, maybe because most of their game are unrated.

I was pr 38-39 when i switch in team game in 2012 and it took me 6 month to hit a sort of decent level in 3v3 (not equal, probably lt co level), and that's was before the team QS which increase more the difference between 1v1 player and 3v3 (because without laming in 3v3 it's pretty much impossible to be top ladder).

Full 1v1 player are absolutly lost in 3v3, i know what i am talking about, most of team game i played on DE was with other 1v1 players and i never reach the top 100 in team game
Only true with full 1v1 one civ bot player who get totally lost in other game modes when you need to exploit a bit more than 10% of the game :p
That's exactly what i am talking about, 1v1 players playing 3v3 just for chilling with no clue about what a team deck mean. I should have quote the comment i replied, because now it's seem than everybody think that i said "pr 25 team players > pr 40 1v1 players". My comment was here to explain why you can have the feeling than a good 1v1 player can sux in team game, because based on my experience, a lot of 1v1 players play team just for chill and don't care about learning the 3v3.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

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Post by Peachrocks »

Kyo_ wrote:1v1s 2v2s and 3v3s are very different games. Being good in 1v1 doesn't guarantee being good in 3v3, and vice versa. I've consistently lost to pr 20s in 1v1, but have also consistently beaten pr 40s in 3v3s. That being said, it is funny how the weaker captains keep winning their games. The balance system in this tournament is glaringly flawed. I hope they don't allow players below pr 28-29 in the next tournament.
If enough players signed, you'd get better drafts. I do agree the balance isn't ideal in some ways however Buddy was an excellent pick from Kaiser. They did exceptionally well all three games, especially the first two and he was the lowest on the team.

To be honest though I think many of the top players don't want to practice with their lower rated team mates because they want to protect their pixel points and playing unranked in lobbies is pointless. So therefore they go in unprepared and unsurprisingly lose. Teaming up with players you know is one thing but being able to work with players of differing skill levels is a skill in itself.

If anything this tournament proves there's way too much emphasis on certain skill sets but that's nothing new.
flontier wrote:
Only true with full 1v1 one civ bot player who get totally lost in other game modes when you need to exploit a bit more than 10% of the game :p
Pretty much this but almost every game is like this now. It's rare true game knowledge actually matters.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

Post by gibson »

princeofkabul wrote:so 2 gibsons with 10 % handicap would absolutely annihilate two top of the food chain teamplayers. interesting.
2 of me with a 10 percent handicap would be fine vs pr40 team players, not absolutely destroy probably. I played Kaiser several times with a 10 percent handicap and all the games were close and I won 1-2, and he’s better than pr40 and I’m worse in 1v1 than team. I’ve also done perfectly fine vs pr40 players in team without a handicap, not in every game but a decent chunk of the time, 10 percent handicap would allow me to basically every game. Mu of course matters a lot.
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Re: 3v3 Tournament Hosted by RøyaL Clan

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Post by Kaiserklein »

Kyo_ wrote:1v1s 2v2s and 3v3s are very different games. Being good in 1v1 doesn't guarantee being good in 3v3, and vice versa. I've consistently lost to pr 20s in 1v1, but have also consistently beaten pr 40s in 3v3s. That being said, it is funny how the weaker captains keep winning their games. The balance system in this tournament is glaringly flawed. I hope they don't allow players below pr 28-29 in the next tournament.
Yeah sure there can be a small skill loss when switching gamemodes, but does it really matter at this point? A PR 30 picking sioux, sweden, inca, japs etc, will usually just perform better than a PR 40 playing a real civ, be it a 1v1 PR 40 or a team PR 40. You don't really need the extra 10 PR to spam caroleans and torps, or send unsnareable chimus everywhere, or run sioux cav around constantly. Also DE only added more of these broken mechanics, especially applying in team games, with the 2 new dumb civs, stupid revolts, and other stuff such as slinging being much better with the new starting crates.

If you don't believe me, go ask Hazza, usually considered the best team player atm, why he'd rather play 1v1 than team nowadays.

When comparing PR20s to PR40s though, you're largely exaggerating.
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