Tit vs Garja

[Aykin Haraka]

wow dam photoshot

[deleted_user0]

try it then, it's good practice. will help you much in life.

I will give you a hint

i got the answer.

generally, when you ask a question, what's the point?

lol why are you getting so salty xD

so what, hazza also forfeited and the rule wasn't applied. Rules were also made for qualifying, and they weren't applied. Doesn't mean much

I was asking for this part of you complaining, if you cant tell. You clearly don't look happy with the decision or rather outcome, so what do you suggest?

No, i dont care about the outcome. I just wasnt happy with brams answer about rules, as the rules have never stopped esoc before when it came to anything. Maybe instead of assuming what other people think. Just read what they write.

Regardless of what was decided... they shouldve made a statement.

[n0el]

Show hidden quotes

try it then, it's good practice. will help you much in life.

I will give you a hint

i got the answer.

generally, when you ask a question, what's the point?

lol why are you getting so salty xD

so what, hazza also forfeited and the rule wasn't applied. Rules were also made for qualifying, and they weren't applied. Doesn't mean much

I was asking for this part of you complaining, if you cant tell. You clearly don't look happy with the decision or rather outcome, so what do you suggest?

No, i dont care about the outcome. I just wasnt happy with brams answer about rules, as the rules have never stopped esoc before when it came to anything. Maybe instead of assuming what other people think. Just read what they write.

Regardless of what was decided... they shouldve made a statement.

Would it be appropriate for ESOC to make a statement about a tournament not run by ESOC?

[deleted_user0]

Show hidden quotes

try it then, it's good practice. will help you much in life.

I will give you a hint

i got the answer.

generally, when you ask a question, what's the point?

lol why are you getting so salty xD

so what, hazza also forfeited and the rule wasn't applied. Rules were also made for qualifying, and they weren't applied. Doesn't mean much

I was asking for this part of you complaining, if you cant tell. You clearly don't look happy with the decision or rather outcome, so what do you suggest?

No, i dont care about the outcome. I just wasnt happy with brams answer about rules, as the rules have never stopped esoc before when it came to anything. Maybe instead of assuming what other people think. Just read what they write.

Regardless of what was decided... they shouldve made a statement.

Would it be appropriate for ESOC to make a statement about a tournament not run by ESOC?

I meant tournament admins. Its irrelevant who they are.

[edeholland]

Show hidden quotes

try it then, it's good practice. will help you much in life.

I will give you a hint

i got the answer.

generally, when you ask a question, what's the point?

lol why are you getting so salty xD

so what, hazza also forfeited and the rule wasn't applied. Rules were also made for qualifying, and they weren't applied. Doesn't mean much

I was asking for this part of you complaining, if you cant tell. You clearly don't look happy with the decision or rather outcome, so what do you suggest?

No, i dont care about the outcome. I just wasnt happy with brams answer about rules, as the rules have never stopped esoc before when it came to anything. Maybe instead of assuming what other people think. Just read what they write.

Regardless of what was decided... they shouldve made a statement.

Would it be appropriate for ESOC to make a statement about a tournament not run by ESOC?

Well, yes.

The tournament administrators for the qualifiers stage are @BrookG, @Cometk, @Mitoe, @Mr_Bramboy, @n0el, @Interjection, & @robo

And there is also the Admin Decisions thread where only Cometk posted it. Clearly this tournament is partly ran by people outside the Escape studio.

[deleted_user0]

Exactly. And the rules also mention lag conditions. So the decision not to continue playing from tit 1-0 is controversial to say the least. And definitely asks for an admin statement regarding this decision. Imo

[Goodspeed]

Just do a coin flip

[Sargsyan]

Doing coin flip is unfair for tit.

[Goodspeed]

Lag is unfair for Garja

[Sargsyan]

Demanding to play from scratch after losing the game and blaming tit for lagging is unfair for tit

[Mr_Bramboy]

Exactly. And the rules also mention lag conditions. So the decision not to continue playing from tit 1-0 is controversial to say the least. And definitely asks for an admin statement regarding this decision. Imo

There was no statement because we felt like clarification was unnecessary. I'll sum up our thoughts for you explaining our decision and how we reached it.

Garja was offered to lagtest yet went offline after Comet said series would continue starting 1-0 Tit. That was when Garja's forfeiture turned into a disqualification. The lag rule(s) (4.2 and 5.4) are irrelevant here. Rule 4.2 explains that we will always take measures first before disqualifying a player for lagging too much. In this case, we don't even know for certain that Tit was the one with the lag, so a lagtest was requested and prompty ignored. Under the relatively new one-touch-forfeiture rule, this situation turned into a disqualification immediately and an admin decision was not needed. Furthermore, Garja was already being watched more closely due to the SoldieR incident in qualifying. We made it pretty clear to him that we would not accept any other rule infringements, even minor ones.

I don't want to get into Garja's motives or thought-process, but anyone who's been following tournaments for the past few years knows that his mentality is not one of the best to put it lightly. I would advise Garja to work on himself instead of continuously blaming others for his behavior. As it stands, Tit advances to the next round and we can put this match behind us.

[Goodspeed]

Demanding to play from scratch after losing the game and blaming tit for lagging is unfair for tit

Losing said game because of lag is unfair to Garja.

Coin flip!

[Sargsyan]

Let me put this clear, losing a game is unfair to garja!!!

[deleted_user0]

I'm not making any final conclusions but isn't it a bit weird that tit/kynesie series seem to be appear laggy quite a lot of times compared to other series? Especially when neither of them never lags vs me in rated. Neither does Garja.

That's why I think the decision is a bit hard for Garja. Especially, after I think he was ready to continue/reschedule about 1 hour after his "rage-quit" decision, If I remember correctly.

[Sargsyan]

Yeah that's weird, they didn't lag vs me too and i played with all of them.

[Mr_Bramboy]

I'm not making any final conclusions but isn't it a bit weird that tit/kynesie series seem to be appear laggy quite a lot of times compared to other series? Especially when neither of them never lags vs me in rated. Neither does Garja.

That's why I think the decision is a bit hard for Garja. Especially, after I think he was ready to continue/reschedule about 1 hour after his "rage-quit" decision, If I remember correctly.

Possible, but the presumption of innocence weighs more in this regard, and any attempts at solving the lag were cast aside by Garja.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Garja has lag issues with a lot of players, it might well come from him honestly.

[Garja]

That's simply false. The only reason why lag is often associated to my name is simply because I point it out more frequently.
Observed games just lag more and sometimes they just lag too much.
My previous series vs sweethegreat have also been considerably laggy at the end when streamed, and no laggy at all when we started it without observers.

[[Armag] diarouga]

That's simply false. The only reason why lag is often associated to my name is simply because I point it out more frequently.
Observed games just lag more and sometimes they just lag too much.
My previous series vs sweethegreat have also been considerably laggy at the end when streamed, and no laggy at all when we started it without observers.

Yes observers and UI add more lag. You have to accept that though because else people wouldn't pay for tourneys.

[Goodspeed]

You shouldn't have to accept that. A compromise is possible: Cast from replays.
I think Garja has a point but it gets ignored because of the way he expresses himself. Severe lag, in my opinion, is plenty of reason to replay a game if it affected the outcome. I don't know if it affected the outcome in this case because I wasn't watching, but the decision to replay the game shouldn't be entirely up to Tit. What if he was causing the lag? The lag switch is a real thing. I'm not saying that's what happened but consider the possibility, and realize how silly you look leaving the decision up to him.

[Kaiserklein]

Yeah I do agree that lag shouldn't be normal and that replaying games that were obviously too laggy should be considered. But if Garja doesn't even want to do a lag test, just goes offline, and kind of blackmails everyone by saying he forfeits if they don't replay it... Not much can be done.

[Goodspeed]

Well, Garja didn't accept the fact that Tit had any say in whether the game would be replayed or not. And he has a point there, too. Being hot-headed and entitled, he then ragequit but later came back on that. The situation I think is more nuanced than people give it credit for here. Garja's point of view shouldn't be discarded without consideration, and I'm kind of getting the impression that's what happened.

[Riotcoke]

I think a problem that you also have is that you have casters that are from different regions of the world to the players, E.g Comtek being from the US when Garja and Tit are both Euros. Creating more lag than necessary.

[deleted_user0]

Well, Garja didn't accept the fact that Tit had any say in whether the game would be replayed or not. And he has a point there, too. Being hot-headed and entitled, he then ragequit but later came back on that. The situation I think is more nuanced than people give it credit for here. Garja's point of view shouldn't be discarded without consideration, and I'm kind of getting the impression that's what happened.

I agree with Goodspeed here. I would have given Garja one more chance to schedule, Tit leading 1-0, now it's too late I guess?

[[Armag] diarouga]

You shouldn't have to accept that. A compromise is possible: Cast from replays.
I think Garja has a point but it gets ignored because of the way he expresses himself. Severe lag, in my opinion, is plenty of reason to replay a game if it affected the outcome. I don't know if it affected the outcome in this case because I wasn't watching, but the decision to replay the game shouldn't be entirely up to Tit. What if he was causing the lag? The lag switch is a real thing. I'm not saying that's what happened but consider the possibility, and realize how silly you look leaving the decision up to him.

Casting from recorded games is better overall for the players, but iirc the admins decided that it wasn't a good solution because :
1) map issues
2) the viewers want to watch the games live.

We all know that Tit didn't use a lag switch, and although I didn't watch the games, the lag probably wasn't that big, garja likes to complain for nothing.