EP 6.1.x Beta [RELEASED-LIVE]

[EAGLEMUT]

i have no idea how much a bank cost currently, its insane.

Now this will blow your mind; it costs the same as on RE

[deleted_user0]

When playing hazza we found out that spanish gold doesnt work for the church card. You dont get 400g if you send the church card. Not sure if there are any other cards it doesnt work for, i imagine if there are, they might be team cards.

[charlemango]

Is this damn patch ever gonna be released?!

[EAGLEMUT]

Is this damn patch ever gonna be released?!

Well, we're at the first Beta iteration so far. Do you have any insights to offer from testing it?

[Mitoe]

Is this damn patch ever gonna be released?!

Well, we're at the first Beta iteration so far. Do you have any insights to offer from testing it?

I haven't heard of a single person testing it aside from myself and Hazza

It's almost like everyone loves the changes and doesn't think they require any prior tests

Edit: no in all seriousness if you guys want to help improve the change list for EP6 it would probably be helpful to play some games and provide some feedback based on your experiences.

[tabben]

I think most people are gonna be too lazy to switch back and forth between beta and normal patch.. I feel like you could just try out the changes on the "normal" EP for a week or so instead of hoping for people to go on a beta patch.

[Mitoe]

I think most people are gonna be too lazy to switch back and forth between beta and normal patch.. I feel like you could just try out the changes on the "normal" EP patch for a week or so instead of hoping for people to go on a beta patch.

I agree, except that there's a tournament on-going.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Is this damn patch ever gonna be released?!

Well, we're at the first Beta iteration so far. Do you have any insights to offer from testing it?

I haven't heard of a single person testing it aside from myself and Hazza

It's almost like everyone loves the changes and doesn't think they require any prior tests

Edit: no in all seriousness if you guys want to help improve the change list for EP6 it would probably be helpful to play some games and provide some feedback based on your experiences.

Remove the fast age up nerf, remove the brit manor nerf, and remove the xbow buff and the patch might be acceptable.

[n0el]

weird. i was going to say remove the daimyo nerfs, remove the zamburak changes and remove the xbow/pike buffs and the patch would be acceptable

[tabben]

I think most people are gonna be too lazy to switch back and forth between beta and normal patch.. I feel like you could just try out the changes on the "normal" EP patch for a week or so instead of hoping for people to go on a beta patch.

I agree, except that there's a tournament on-going.

Well there's almost always some sort of tournament going on. I guess we could have a tournament patch in the EP launcher to allow for more testing throughout the year.

[[Armag] diarouga]

weird. i was going to say remove the daimyo nerfs, remove the zamburak changes and remove the xbow/pike buffs and the patch would be acceptable

The daymio nerf and the zamburak changes are both bad too imo but not nearly as impactful.

Japan is unfairly nerfed, but since I don't really play Japan anymore, although it makes me sad to see that an interesting civ will be UP, I can live with that.
Same with the zam nerf, you don't really want to make zams currently because the unit is weak, so it won't impact the meta, people will still go full sepoy lol. It's worth mentioning that nerfing a unit you almost never see in 1v1 doesn't make a lot of sense, especially when you claim that you want to add unit diversity

[Garja]

Manor cost, among others bad changes, is really dumb imo. Vills take forever to build manors already and Brits are also overrated.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Manor cost, among others bad changes, is really dumb imo. Vills take forever to build manors already and Brits are also overrated.

Yea, you shouldn't touch manors lol.
Brit is probably slightly overrated but it's still one of the strongest civs.
Anyway, when rouga, caria and Umeu agree to say that a change is bad, you know it really is.

[Mitoe]

Yeah, from my experience so far with India/Brit it seems like these changes only make the civs feel clunky and unrewarding to play. Would like to see these reverted.

I personally don't think fast age should be reverted--not yet anyway (although maybe 45 seconds?). I would really like to see how buffing slow age from 110 seconds to 100 seconds would do in tandem with this change: I feel like it would open the door for a wider variety of strategies in a similarly wide variety of situations, and I don't think it's as hard to balance as it sounds, either.

I think it's also apparent that the Teepee change probably needs to be reverted and alternative solutions sought out: this has been changed every patch since its inception and still doesn't feel balanced nor function as originally intended.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Buffing slow age up would make Brit and Spain too strong, that's the issue.

[deleted_user0]

the patch is goooood. balance remains just fine with new fast age and brit manors.

[Mitoe]

Buffing slow age up would make Brit and Spain too strong, that's the issue.

Maybe. I would argue you can potentially revert a lot of changes as a result of it though. French can have their 120f CDB back, Germans can have their Uhlans back (or maybe some other kind of compensation: reducing their shipment penalty from 10% to 8% would be nice considering that it would also help them be more competitive in situations where they cannot construct a TP), could possibly revert the Indian house change or increase it's cost slightly to compensate. It also helps some of the arguably weaker civs like Japan and Russia without actually making any changes to them.

Plus it makes Fortress less overwhelming on TP maps, while less underwhelming on non-TP maps where you would probably prefer to slow age because you might not have a shipment available when you hit age 3 otherwise.

Right now it's just such a bad option that you only do it if your civ is forced to do it--doesn't that indicate some kind of problem? Is it really a good thing that Spain literally can't do anything other than FF in 90% situations because if they don't start aging as early as possible they usually can't ever get away with aging? Or the same for Aztec or Iro for that matter--if you fast age to Colonial you virtually have to commit to staying Colonial. Aztec, sure, can age still age I guess, but they have to commit very hard to doing it, and other options are not very good because it will take you too long to get up otherwise.

[Hazza54321]

Manor cost, among others bad changes, is really dumb imo. Vills take forever to build manors already and Brits are also overrated.

agreed

[Garja]

the patch is goooood. balance remains just fine with new fast age and brit manors.

balance may remain fine but why change stuff when it already is fine

[n0el]

Because the semi ff Meta is boring as hell?

[Garja]

80% of the changes have nothing to do with the semi FF meta

[n0el]

Fast age was specifically mentioned in the post you asked why make changes

[Garja]

And so was the manor build time.
Besides, do we even need fast age change when all fast age civs are nerfed and slow aging civs are already better?

[n0el]

Not sure to be honest. But some people surely think that. Brit nerf seems clear as a result of fast age nerf.

[flontier]

India : house + sepoy + zamb + shipment xp different.
German : Not a single age2 unit is the same, bow/pik cost, dopp and ulhan hp, and add this the different age up time to age3
And i wont speak about the infamous sioux.
Are you guys sure that stacking changes like this is good for the patch ?

I mean, how we're going to make the meta more interesting by stacking change like this ? it wont change the semi ff meta.
We'll just change the way some civ are played. The meta is more and more greedy af because of the map way more than the original civ design and change, people tend to play always more economic and its normal when you can sit in base with hunt until 15min, so ofc we have a lot of semi ff, wall and others defensive play style. You can nerf the semi ff of a civ, its going to buff the semi ff of another civ like its the case with these new changes.