Scaling mercenaries
Scaling mercenaries
Hi guys!
Some days ago a tested techtree and realized its pretty easy to implement new shadows into the game.
So had idea to make mercenaries scaling into industrial and imperial ages. Now mercenaries become useless when a civ age up and have acces guard units.
I think they should be auto upgraded when hit age 4 and age 5, to appeal the same way when they are in age 3.
Some days ago a tested techtree and realized its pretty easy to implement new shadows into the game.
So had idea to make mercenaries scaling into industrial and imperial ages. Now mercenaries become useless when a civ age up and have acces guard units.
I think they should be auto upgraded when hit age 4 and age 5, to appeal the same way when they are in age 3.
Re: Scaling mercenaries
Hell no. It's inherent to the unit to not scale. Being strong in mid game and not in late game.
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Re: Scaling mercenaries
Mercenaries are the coolest thing ever. Nothing sadder than seeing them get irrelevant in favor of some industrialized guard musket spam.
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Re: Scaling mercenaries
Can't they already scale okay into industrial if you're Germany? With the base stats on some mercs the merc card + AA must give more raw attack or hp than most units get throughout their entire upgrade path.
Either way there's still the issue of production, 1 facility is pretty useless late game unless you're only making lil bombards or something.
Either way there's still the issue of production, 1 facility is pretty useless late game unless you're only making lil bombards or something.
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Re: Scaling mercenaries
Saloon limit increases by 2 in age 4. Problem solved.
Or by 1 in age 3 and by 1 again in age 4
Or by 1 in age 3 and by 1 again in age 4
Re: Scaling mercenaries
Most of the mercenaries are bad for cost effectivity. It means they are not worth to buy even in age 3. If they scale it doesnt change anything on that. They will be the same bad units for cost effectivity. Only difference is in the "same" word instead of "worse".
Plus where they matter is the cards. Unfortunately on competitive side the whole mercenary cards system is screwed. There are a very few which are good and the others unused and there was no particular change on EP to change these cards. Only mamelukes card were changed. But i dont think youve ever seen Stradiots, Landschknechts, Highlanders etc.
Plus where they matter is the cards. Unfortunately on competitive side the whole mercenary cards system is screwed. There are a very few which are good and the others unused and there was no particular change on EP to change these cards. Only mamelukes card were changed. But i dont think youve ever seen Stradiots, Landschknechts, Highlanders etc.
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Re: Scaling mercenaries
I would love to see Landsknechts viable in some way. I always sent them in German tower rushes if I was winning
Re: Scaling mercenaries
I think having them scale would be fun, but I would not make their shadow guard and imp techs full strength (maybe 15/20% and 25/30% instead of normal 30% and 50%).
somppukunkku wrote:This is not a fucking discogame.
Re: Scaling mercenaries
Darwin_ wrote:I think having them scale would be fun, but I would not make their shadow guard and imp techs full strength (maybe 15/20% and 25/30% instead of normal 30% and 50%).
The math question is also pretty easy to solve.
Its 1.5=1.2*x
It could be also for use units like cuirassiers which also scaling from their "veteran" base stats.
So yeah there is no issue there that they would be too strong. They would be the same strong compared to guard units as they are in age3 compared to veterans.
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Re: Scaling mercenaries
I think tweaking the stats/cost of Mercs that are never used would be a fun Idea, and the shadow teching to IV/V as well. But maybe instead of implementing these changes to a new EP patch, it would make more sense to first test some of it on the Smackdown Patch. @Interjection
Re: Scaling mercenaries
Japan's two last consulate unit are just ronin and ninjas that scale and imperial hatamoto should give you an idea how very quickly mercs will break if you scale them normally
Re: Scaling mercenaries
thisGarja wrote:mercs are simply not meant to scale......
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Re: Scaling mercenaries
Imperial Mamelukes. :)
Re: Scaling mercenaries
The way mercenaries work in this game is as a trade-off of resource efficiency for timing. This is similar to things like idling your town center for a 10/10, or buying wood and food at the market with your bank gold while you defend a rush as Dutch. These things arenāt optimally resource efficient, but they allow you to do things you otherwise couldnāt like rush super early or defend and go to fortress. Mercs, likewise, are resource inefficient, but when times properly, can win you a game. An example is a port player sending mams against an age2 rush, or adding jaegers to a German FF to deal with a booming age2 Brit player. At very specific times in a game, certain civs have no counter to mercs and so therefore they are effective even tho they are resource inefficient more generally.
Scaling mercs would seriously change this dynamic which might drastically alter competitive play.
Scaling mercs would seriously change this dynamic which might drastically alter competitive play.
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Re: Scaling mercenaries
I don't see how mercs aren't cost efficient. I mean obviously some mercs are bad, just like some units are bad (think halbs, grens, etc). But the good mercs are definitely cost efficient.
The problem of mercs is more that shipping them takes an extra 20s and costs 1000g, which is a risky investment (you might just die while they're otw). And building a saloon means you're likely to get a useless merc and waste 200w. Also it ruins your gold mines, which is a problem for some civs.
The problem of mercs is more that shipping them takes an extra 20s and costs 1000g, which is a risky investment (you might just die while they're otw). And building a saloon means you're likely to get a useless merc and waste 200w. Also it ruins your gold mines, which is a problem for some civs.
LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
Re: Scaling mercenaries
Yea in my post I meant, they become cost-efficient when used properly in a timing. But if you just set up two AIs with equal eco spamming units against eachother and one was spamming upgraded skirms and the other was spamming jaegers, wouldn't the skirmisher AI ultimately win, since it would be trading villager seconds more efficiently? That's what I meant by cost-effective.
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Re: Scaling mercenaries
That's the point, jaegers are more cost effective than skirms. Same goes for several mercs
LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
Re: Scaling mercenaries
Garja wrote:mercs are simply not meant to scale......
What does this mean?
last time i cryed was because i stood on Legoļ»æ
Re: Scaling mercenaries
it means if you add 30% to a merc in industrial and another 50% in imperial you get very broken mercs like.... 2000+ hp mams, 200+ attack hackapells, 150+ Attack Highlanders, 700 attack invincible lil bombards...
Re: Scaling mercenaries
dansil92 wrote:it means if you add 30% to a merc in industrial and another 50% in imperial you get very broken mercs like.... 2000+ hp mams, 200+ attack hackapells, 150+ Attack Highlanders, 700 attack invincible lil bombards...
Indian elephant has more than 2300 HP and there is no problem in that so your argument is not worth.
It's all about balancing the right price for the units.
Re: Scaling mercenaries
Mahouts are six pop not 4. Oh and like 700 res each. Please. Continue to tell me its balanced.
Re: Scaling mercenaries
Maybe because of the translation of the Portuguese language into English (google translator), my thinking was not clear.
I mean that if unit prices are adjusted / balanced properly, there will be no problem climbing mercenaries.
That's why I used the Indian elephant as an example, because although it has incredible statistics, due to its cost (price and pop) it is not OP.
I mean that if unit prices are adjusted / balanced properly, there will be no problem climbing mercenaries.
That's why I used the Indian elephant as an example, because although it has incredible statistics, due to its cost (price and pop) it is not OP.
Re: Scaling mercenaries
what's the point of polls that last only a week
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Re: Scaling mercenaries
I don't think this would be so bad if it was set as a tech similar to legendary natives. 30%-100% improved stats for like 1000 or so resources in the imperial age. It would make mercs not totally useless in imperial.
It would rarely ever be used, but would make Merc cards more worth it once imperial has been reached. Mercs aren't great in 4 but still ok stats wise. Once imperial they are usually worse than their base units when cost/pop space comes into effect.
I wouldn't have mercs auto tech. You could mess balance up with that. It could potentially (however unlikely) make industrial too powerful. Those age 3 Merc cards are now age 4 Merc cards. Could be hard to balance.
Still. Imperial mamelukes. :)
It would rarely ever be used, but would make Merc cards more worth it once imperial has been reached. Mercs aren't great in 4 but still ok stats wise. Once imperial they are usually worse than their base units when cost/pop space comes into effect.
I wouldn't have mercs auto tech. You could mess balance up with that. It could potentially (however unlikely) make industrial too powerful. Those age 3 Merc cards are now age 4 Merc cards. Could be hard to balance.
Still. Imperial mamelukes. :)
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