Consideration for EP9 - Priests

[helln00]

I think it would be really cool if priest or spies counter mercs and natives not by killing them but converting them. Imagine 4 mams charging for the blow only for it to turn back.

[dansil92]

I think it would be really cool if priest or spies counter mercs and natives not by killing them but converting them. Imagine 4 mams charging for the blow only for it to turn back.

This is literally the entire reason i refuse to play aoe2

[n0el]

I think it would be really cool if priest or spies counter mercs and natives not by killing them but converting them. Imagine 4 mams charging for the blow only for it to turn back.

This is literally the entire reason i refuse to play aoe2

because your units could be converted?

[dansil92]

I think it would be really cool if priest or spies counter mercs and natives not by killing them but converting them. Imagine 4 mams charging for the blow only for it to turn back.

This is literally the entire reason i refuse to play aoe2

because your units could be converted?

Yes its a stupid mechanic

[n0el]

Show hidden quotes

I think it would be really cool if priest or spies counter mercs and natives not by killing them but converting them. Imagine 4 mams charging for the blow only for it to turn back.

This is literally the entire reason i refuse to play aoe2

because your units could be converted?

Yes its a stupid mechanic

Well, not really since you can't convert really high value units without a later game tech. Monks are insanely weak and are expensive, so even if you convert 1 archer or scout, its a big loss if you lose your monk.

[chronique]

Show hidden quotes

I think it would be really cool if priest or spies counter mercs and natives not by killing them but converting them. Imagine 4 mams charging for the blow only for it to turn back.

This is literally the entire reason i refuse to play aoe2

because your units could be converted?

Yes its a stupid mechanic

This is everything but stupide mechanic lol, its one of the essence of aoe, the king of meme, the knigh of justice, the god of ... well its cool.

[helln00]

also they are extremely micro intensive and also sort of rng based

[duckzilla]

In aoe2 monks were rather weak units with two powerful abilities.
In aoe3 priests in colo are resilient units (measured by hp) with bad abilities. While their abilities do not drastically improve over the course of the game, their one strength (hp) is not affected by any upgrades. A priest in colonial is identical to a priest in imperial age (according to wiki). wtf?

If (!) priests were viable in colo, their hp/heal speed would at least be upgradable to +100% to make them equally viable in late-game. Who even designed this unit?!

[dansil92]

Isn't mission fervour a like, 35% hp upgrade or am i mixing that up woth compunction?

[duckzilla]

You are correct, it gives +35% hp and is available in colonial (which is even more confusing?!).

[Victor_swe]

Some native medicineman had The ability that healed units in a ring like The port spyglass. Was op but much more interesting than The healing atm.

[harcha]

Some native medicineman had The ability that healed units in a ring like The port spyglass. Was op but much more interesting than The healing atm.

i think you're talking about nilla. they changed healing from a manual ability to a passive thing going into TWC/TAD

[iCourt]

French explorer card still has the manual ability.

[Victor_swe]

Some native medicineman had The ability that healed units in a ring like The port spyglass. Was op but much more interesting than The healing atm.

i think you're talking about nilla. they changed healing from a manual ability to a passive thing going into TWC/TAD

Ye thats it. And some map hade nativea were native treaty would give u like 6 of those and some other shit. So u just had an army that never died

[edeholland]

I think it would be really cool if priest or spies counter mercs and natives not by killing them but converting them. Imagine 4 mams charging for the blow only for it to turn back.

This is literally the entire reason i refuse to play aoe2

because your units could be converted?

The RNG involved in AoE2 monks is really frustrating

[iNcog]

One of the most epic monk plays ever played in any game in the entire universe:



MBL is GodBL. He just calmly explains his master plan and then just does it. Fucking ends the game right then and there.

[Peachrocks]

Show hidden quotes

I think it would be really cool if priest or spies counter mercs and natives not by killing them but converting them. Imagine 4 mams charging for the blow only for it to turn back.

This is literally the entire reason i refuse to play aoe2

because your units could be converted?

The RNG involved in AoE2 monks is really frustrating

Yeah the really silly thing is that it should scale based on cost and has a progress bar. No random nonsense. Or hell if you wanted to keep the whole 'they counter expensive units thing' the conversion bar should be public knowledge. It's not like units suddenly 'die' you can see their health, why are conversions random? You'd never get away with it these days.

In other thoughts, the major reason Priests don't get used in aoe3 is because they are a win more at best and a liability in terms of expense and population at worst. A significant amount of games in aoe3 are decided with one major exchange, usually in the center, usually in late age 2 or early-mid age 3. Priests in this case do nothing because they can only heal wounded units that aren't in battle and if they win the battle, it's overkill (i.e a win more) and if everything dies they are a waste of resources. This can apply somewhat to all stages throughout the game on top of just being 'one more thing to manage'.

Really, I don't think it'd do any good, but combining the old passive healing ability from vanilla with passive healing so that they can be useful in battle and not just after it as well as the passive healing might help a little but really I doubt it. They just have a niche that just isn't that useful 90% of the time.

You could try giving all priests the 'unction treatment' as a morale boost (slightly less of course) and then make Spain's card improve the effect though that won't lead to anywhere desirable I'm pretty sure, but that's for everyone else to decide. I just don't see a way of making healing an interesting engaging mechanic without it being insanely obnoxious. So either priests remain extremely niche at best or an entirely new ability is given to them.

[fei123456]

100 gold for a priest is quite enough. Priest have high HP but it just doesn't make sense: do anyone use priests to tank damage?

[Mitoe]

As someone with little experience or knowledge of AoE2 and therefore has no clue what he is talking about...

The whole idea of conversion mechanics is really unappealing to me.

[Astaroth]

Also keep in mind that even the absolute top players in aoe2 with really high apm very rarely make monks to heal their units or use them as such, unless they already have monks due to using them as military or for relics. And even then healing is usually just an afterthought. Sure, every now and then someone lile Viper will pull back a low hp knight to heal him, but that is more of a one-off occurrence and not generally part of his gameplan (unlike eg getting relics).

All that despite the monks being cheaper than in aoe3 and healing units even while fighting etc.

Thr healing ability alone is usually just too much hassle.

[duckzilla]

Also keep in mind that even the absolute top players in aoe2 with really high apm very rarely make monks to heal their units or use them as such, unless they already have monks due to using them as military or for relics. And even then healing is usually just an afterthought. Sure, every now and then someone lile Viper will pull back a low hp knight to heal him, but that is more of a one-off occurrence and not generally part of his gameplan (unlike eg getting relics).

All that despite the monks being cheaper than in aoe3 and healing units even while fighting etc.

Thr healing ability alone is usually just too much hassle.

Debatable. Everything is cheaper in aoe2 (villagers 50f, houses 20w, archers 25w/45g, scouts 80f, knights 60f/75g). Since gold is much more valuable in aoe2 than in aoe3, I would say that monks are actually quite expensive. Maybe more expensive than in aoe3.

[helln00]

Yeah healing has never been a big thing in aoe. Monks are mostly used for conversions and healing is only used by a very select group of players in very all in stratergies.

The problem is that priest in aoe 3 have no other role so its inevitable that they wont be used much, its telling that the only other use for healing units is unction missionaries.

If healing is supposed to be viable it atleast should be better than just making another unit and like the only time that has ever been good is h20 ele strats.

[helln00]

actually one thing that could improve priest massively atleast is to allow for healing units while those units are moving. Ensuring that units are actually standing still is a pain in the ass.

[iNcog]

As someone with little experience or knowledge of AoE2 and therefore has no clue what he is talking about...

The whole idea of conversion mechanics is really unappealing to me.

You lose a unit, the opponent gets a unit. It's a 2 unit swing that does a fair amount in fights. Some units are susceptible to conversions, like heavy cav (Knights and Elephants). Some units / civilizations resist conversion (light cav, Teutons).

It seems that at a high level, players might be 5 or so monks and use those conversions to swing fights. Converting siege units (Mangonel = falconet on steriods with shots that can miss) can also swing things.

I don't think conversion has a place in AOE3 but they implemented it rather well in AOE2

[Plantinator]

As someone with little experience or knowledge of AoE2 and therefore has no clue what he is talking about...

The whole idea of conversion mechanics is really unappealing to me.

You lose a unit, the opponent gets a unit. It's a 2 unit swing that does a fair amount in fights. Some units are susceptible to conversions, like heavy cav (Knights and Elephants). Some units / civilizations resist conversion (light cav, Teutons).

It seems that at a high level, players might be 5 or so monks and use those conversions to swing fights. Converting siege units (Mangonel = falconet on steriods with shots that can miss) can also swing things.

I don't think conversion has a place in AOE3 but they implemented it rather well in AOE2

Its so hard on Steroids one afk shot can anhilate all of ur own pikes haha

Edit: just imagine how Different the game wouldve been if they kept that mechanic so falcs also hit ur own men in a melee brawl...