EP 9.0.x Beta [RELEASED-LIVE]

[chris1089]

No spain nerf?

Whats wrong with Spain?

Seem one of the stronger civs to me.

[Black_Duck]

No spain nerf?

Whats wrong with Spain?

Seem one of the stronger civs to me.

Over which sample have you come to this conclusion?

[Cometk]

Who's in the patch team atm?

Someone who recently played a drawn-out 50 minutes slugfest vs. waterbros.

The water changes (wouldn’t call them nerfs, since warships already shred land units) were actually a joint recommendation from kynesie and breeze to make the cards more balanced across civilizations and thus every civ a little more reasonable at contesting water

[dansil92]

Time to remove the XPDONATE emoji

[oxaloacetate]

Who's in the patch team atm?

Someone who recently played a drawn-out 50 minutes slugfest vs. waterbros.

The water changes (wouldn’t call them nerfs, since warships already shred land units) were actually a joint recommendation from kynesie and breeze to make the cards more balanced across civilizations and thus every civ a little more reasonable at contesting water

If that is the case, it sounds like a uniform and productive change, although few of the cards actually sees game time.

[chris1089]

Show hidden quotes

No spain nerf?

Whats wrong with Spain?

Seem one of the stronger civs to me.

Over which sample have you come to this conclusion?

Mainly playing you to be fair. Seems a lot stronger than your port though.
Tbf it's mainly based off a game I played against Perez where age 2 went almost perfectly, I followed up and he already had Spanish gold and then held easily.
Iro and Brit seem stronger to me, but it could just be the match ups v french.

[Garja]

I mean, other than Diarouga and Breeze (of which I can totally see the fault) who's also in there? Mitoe, Kaiser?
I can't find a single change in this beta that can be called good. The least worse change is probably changing missionary effect (basically useless change) and that says a lot. Warship changes are conceptually good (I voiced for them in past) but it's not like water play was in a bad shape now. Everything else ranges from mistimed to straight up bad.

[lemmings121]

Why are we pushing a new beta, when the game has 3 days more to live before DE?
I would just push the previous beta as oficial and call it a day. If something goes wrong with DE we can go back to a stable EP.. There is no reason to push a new beta that noone will playtest.

[Garja]

Ye, speculating on balance without the DE changes is a bit pointless.
I guess the community needs a backup environment in case DE is not suitable for tourneys and stuff.

[look]

no sense new beta..

[BrookG]

EP Team: viewtopic.php?f=466&t=20539

[Mitoe]

I think Eaglemut wants to make sure there are no bugs present before pushing it live.

I’m at work right now, will comment on changes later, but briefly: water changes were actually primarily all suggested by Breeze/Kynesie as a way to reduce the overwhelming advantage of some civs over others on water. This should make it more fair for most civs while still giving an advantage to those civs in heavy water games.

[EAGLEMUT]

Yep, if you folks find any bugs or have feedback on the bloom change, it would be great if you can report it here in this thread.

Otherwise we will go through with switching EP9 to stable soon.

[harcha]

why we have 190w villages again? anyone!? i thought we agreed that this is ugly and completely unnecessary on fixed crates no?

[Black_Duck]

Show hidden quotes

No spain nerf?

Whats wrong with Spain?

Seem one of the stronger civs to me.

Over which sample have you come to this conclusion?

Mainly playing you to be fair. Seems a lot stronger than your port though.
Tbf it's mainly based off a game I played against Perez where age 2 went almost perfectly, I followed up and he already had Spanish gold and then held easily.
Iro and Brit seem stronger to me, but it could just be the match ups v french.

Ive played a huge amount more games with spain than I have with port I think and ports were distinctly average on land on ep8 too. Spain can be countered so easily. I can beat higher ranked spain players if they let me counter pick them.

[deleted_user]

190w villages were defenitely needed for china as they have atleast 6-7 mus that go very bad for them for being late, it will just speed china timings a little bit without making the civ broken imo, current china was performing badly in special mus hopefully they will be okay after this change, Also btw I seriously hate the card "ugly" when it comes to discuss balance changes, it's just a game, no need to be so much serious about it... like the "ugly" propaganda is also one of the main reason why we couldnt fix ports, if we just added cheaper vills with decent crate starts they would completely be ok but cheaper vills are ugly!

[Mitoe]

why we have 190w villages again? anyone!? i thought we agreed that this is ugly and completely unnecessary on fixed crates no?

It is ugly, yeah. The general consensus was that 300f 300w would be too strong, and 200f 300w might be too weak. It was the best compromise.

[Garja]

"definetely needed"
FOR FAKE SAKE it is a useless -10w reduction that doesn't change jack shit for China (aging few secs earlier it's completely irrelevant).
"ugly propaganda". 190w, one hundred fuckin ninety wood. Make it 189w next fuckin time. You know, that 1w is definetely needed for China to be competitive and the odd number is no problem at all.
What a moron.

Man the EP team work on balance is so fuckin disappointing. I don't even play the game and watching this level of incompetence is so disturbing.
How can you even remotely think 10w is anywhere relevant when the average 35+ player doesn't even micro his vills on wood properly and keeps wasting 5w everytime he ejects the vills out of the TC.

[pérez]

it is not irrelevant, idk if it is needed, but not irrelevant for sure, since 10 wood is 20 food which is like some secs faster age and some secs also faster summer palace batch.
Not super relevant neither but it has some seconds of snowball.

[Cometk]

+5w to manor houses and +5f to coureurs led to a big performance differences in brit & france gameplay. don't discount this village cost buff to china

[Rohbrot]

Show hidden quotes

No spain nerf?

Whats wrong with Spain?

Seem one of the stronger civs to me.

Over which sample have you come to this conclusion?

Mainly playing you to be fair. Seems a lot stronger than your port though.
Tbf it's mainly based off a game I played against Perez where age 2 went almost perfectly, I followed up and he already had Spanish gold and then held easily.
Iro and Brit seem stronger to me, but it could just be the match ups v french.

Why do you try to compare a top10 player (atm) with yourself xD

[chris1089]

Show hidden quotes

No spain nerf?

Whats wrong with Spain?

Seem one of the stronger civs to me.

Over which sample have you come to this conclusion?

Mainly playing you to be fair. Seems a lot stronger than your port though.
Tbf it's mainly based off a game I played against Perez where age 2 went almost perfectly, I followed up and he already had Spanish gold and then held easily.
Iro and Brit seem stronger to me, but it could just be the match ups v french.

Why do you try to compare a top10 player (atm) with yourself xD

Because he messed up and I played well that game so it was competitive up till minute 8-9 or so.

[Garja]

it is not irrelevant, idk if it is needed, but not irrelevant for sure, since 10 wood is 20 food which is like some secs faster age and some secs also faster summer palace batch.
Not super relevant neither but it has some seconds of snowball.

First of all aging a bit faster doesn't change jack shit. China could age at 5min and still do the same shit. Did you ever see H2O caring about aging super fast with any Asian civ? Those civs are just supposed to age that late (unless you do some very specific strat which usually emulates Euro civs). There are dozens of more important things than aging 10 secs faster with China.
Second, there are so many factors that affect age up time that the 10w is completely eclipsed. Just think about treasures or distances in resources around the TC. Also every single top player makes so many vill micro mistakes in age1. I already mentioned the no wood vill micro. Then there is the wonder placement micro. The goat killing micro. The fact that most of players don't even use the goat in age1 (and then focus so much on the aging up time, like I'm speachless).
I'ts practically an irrelevant change and not worth changin a simple rounded cost into a nonsense 190w.

[Garja]

+5w to manor houses and +5f to coureurs led to a big performance differences in brit & france gameplay. don't discount this village cost buff to china

Yes and even -2w on Jap shrines made a bit of a difference. But for China it's completely irrelevant as there is almost no snowball effect out of it. All those changes affect the booming curve. The China change is a mere gain in age up time.

[pérez]

ye that is true, i fked up a but didnt matter at all, i prolly outmicroed a bit on the main fight but wasnt really relevant at all since the fight wasnt even close, i think the civ is really strong, not sure if a nerf is needed but the civ felt super strong when i tried them or when i watched opti playing them too or played vs him