Poll: Would you play ESOC FP?

If ESOC was to release a fan patch (more info in post), would you play it and why?

Yes, because I want to be able to play all civs.
154
48%
Yes, because I want to play rated on ESOC maps.
84
26%
Yes, for a different reason.
19
6%
No, because it will be hard to find games on my level.
32
10%
No, because I don't want any civs to change.
9
3%
No, for a different reason.
26
8%
 
Total votes: 324

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India _DB_
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Poll: Would you play ESOC FP?

Post by _DB_ »

edeholland wrote:
subzero wrote:Everyone today knows how to play a single match up with a civ vs every civ.
Then why did you start ~20 threads about matchups?

I dont think it would be fun to play against original otto/iro in quick search.
Obviously it isnt. Losing to a lame civ is often regrettable. For same reason I spammed threads about playing vs lame civs.

Top players know how to actually play vs lame civs.

Playing vs lame civs on unrated occassion is fun.

On rated occasion and winning vs lame civs is more fun.

Losing in rated occasion vs lame civs probably very annoying for you but imo, most players should think "It isnt my fault if Im losing faking lame civs".

Above the quoted post from original post, I did mention some balances which include nerfs for otto too.
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Netherlands momuuu
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Post by momuuu »

bart331 wrote:Also the auto update thinh sounds nice in theory , but i dont want crying kids here 247 about nerfing x or y. I also dont want a civ of the week sysytem with every week new balance patches

It think that was kinda related to the map pool or something. Anyhow, auto updating would be super OP.

Btw, I would help testing but Im probably not good enough. I guess I could help with some Dutch testing.
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Netherlands edeholland
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Post by edeholland »

subzero wrote:
edeholland wrote:Then why did you start ~20 threads about matchups?

I dont think it would be fun to play against original otto/iro in quick search.
Top players know how to actually play vs lame civs.
The idea about lame civs is that they (almost) always win, so no, top players dont know how to play against lame civs. Top players wont be able to beat a good iro/otto with french/brit/germ/whatever. They are OP, they win every matchup, and that means they arent fun to play against.
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Post by momuuu »

edeholland wrote:
subzero wrote:Top players know how to actually play vs lame civs.
The idea about lame civs is that they (almost) always win, so no, top players dont know how to play against lame civs. Top players wont be able to beat a good iro/otto with french/brit/germ/whatever. They are OP, they win every matchup, and that means they arent fun to play against.?

Dutch vs Otto is one of my favorite mus actually.
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Germany yemshi
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Post by yemshi »

I voted for yes, I want to be able to say' "Hey I'm better then you" and not: "Hey, I'm not better then you but I won because your are mapscrewed."
I don't see it happening though, but if I'd play it for sure.
And a little thing: If we patch the civs: don't nerf Iro/Otto etc improve the bad civs. This way the otto's don't cry because their otto is nearly untouched but the port and dutch guy exults because his civs gets better. I'd go for minimal changes though, DO NOT change the system of the civs. but if you give skirm/muskets and this stuff just better stats they'll be able to hold otto ff.
But again I don't see it happening with max 1000 players. Sad but true.
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Post by momuuu »

I play 60% of my games with people I know, and 30% with people I dont really know, but are involved with this community. I cant imagine Ill be having more issues finding games.
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Great Britain britishmusketeer
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Post by britishmusketeer »

I think monitors have no place in the game. They basically mean that if someone is on water you have no way of pushing their base, artillery is useless, towers by the water become useless, meanwhile you are losing a plantation or factory every 60 seconds...
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Netherlands Goodspeed
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Post by Goodspeed »

r4go wrote:I appreciate very much your idea, but I''ll be honest, as you claim to do a patch with an adequate budget civ here when no one understood the power of the Jap, many pros say that China sucks and that the Russians are too strong ?? I think that only H20 is really Enlarged to create a Civil decent budget, with all due respect to those who are working on this idea, I do not want to be totally offensive, but the posts and comments seen so far, I see here that there are pros They believe the best of Iamgrunt and others. Pro that they are very childish and rather than admit they use the Civil stronger shoot stupid absurd, many pros now would not have to rank that age if she stayed active and played by players with enormous talent. I than many I have been fortunate to play at age since 2006, following many dynamics that even garja, which I think is a very good player, has been able to follow because it was not yet logged in the community of ESO, I was lucky enough to play and lose vs good players and exchange views with them, and to be honest, the first major difference I find between the active aging and the current age, and no one has really understood 100% the power of each civ. I do not say that I have understood, I have never been a pro team in 1v1 and only maybe I can say I played at a good level, but I think that to make a balanced FP is very difficult seeing the dynamics of today''s thinking on the Civil Code, as well as the new maps ESO resourceful favor Turtle and strategies are disadvantageous as the off the map. Anyway thanks for the work they are doing however, is admirable passion that you put, I have expressed my opinion that obviously can like as not, and if I could give advice on the budget civ I would be delighted. Sincerely R4go
As unreadable as your post is, I think I have some idea of what you''re saying. A couple of points:

[ul type="disc"][li]I agree that mapping out balance in detail is not possible since the meta keeps evolving and the maps keep changing. However some civ balance issues are undisputed. Yes there are differences of opinion in many cases but everyone agrees Iro and Otto are too strong and everyone agrees Ports and Dutch are too weak, for example. This is one of the reasons why we decided to go with minimal changes and only to civs that we all agree are not balanced.
[/li][li]H2O is in the team working on this, along with pretty much all other ESOC staff plus some other experts. [/li][li]Anyone is free to suggest changes but you''d have to get creative to find a good one we haven''t yet thought of.[/li][/ul]
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Netherlands Goodspeed
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Post by Goodspeed »

bart331 wrote:Also the auto update thinh sounds nice in theory , but i dont want crying kids here 247 about nerfing x or y. I also dont want a civ of the week sysytem with every week new balance patches
Not gonna happen. There will be at least a few months (perhaps a tournament season) between balance patches unless it''s to undo a change which turned out to be bad.
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France [Armag] diarouga
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Post by [Armag] diarouga »

r4go wrote:I appreciate very much your idea, but I''ll be honest, as you claim to do a patch with an adequate budget civ here when no one understood the power of the Jap, many pros say that China sucks and that the Russians are too strong ?? I think that only H20 is really Enlarged to create a Civil decent budget, with all due respect to those who are working on this idea, I do not want to be totally offensive, but the posts and comments seen so far, I see here that there are pros They believe the best of Iamgrunt and others. Pro that they are very childish and rather than admit they use the Civil stronger shoot stupid absurd, many pros now would not have to rank that age if she stayed active and played by players with enormous talent. I than many I have been fortunate to play at age since 2006, following many dynamics that even garja, which I think is a very good player, has been able to follow because it was not yet logged in the community of ESO, I was lucky enough to play and lose vs good players and exchange views with them, and to be honest, the first major difference I find between the active aging and the current age, and no one has really understood 100% the power of each civ. I do not say that I have understood, I have never been a pro team in 1v1 and only maybe I can say I played at a good level, but I think that to make a balanced FP is very difficult seeing the dynamics of today''s thinking on the Civil Code, as well as the new maps ESO resourceful favor Turtle and strategies are disadvantageous as the off the map. Anyway thanks for the work they are doing however, is admirable passion that you put, I have expressed my opinion that obviously can like as not, and if I could give advice on the budget civ I would be delighted. Sincerely R4go
China is ok but for from being op. And I think every good players understand that russia is the worst civ.
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Post by Mimsy for President »

calmyourtits wrote:[ul type="disc"][li]Anyone is free to suggest changes but you''d have to get creative to find a good one we haven''t yet thought of.[/li][/ul]
Whoa ! I''m not sure whether it''s suprapretentious or just a trick to "prevent" [strike]peasants[/strike] people from contributing. :-X
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Post by momuuu »

Just wondering, what are the type of changes you're considering for ports?
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Post by irage »

I had few questions about the fan patch ,
First of all how many players can u rope in to use the fan patch , there are a lot of people who don't use the esoc community site, maybe like Japanese community, wont that reduce the number of games we already have , like lets say in qs or something. ( community will split and we obviously get lesser games, as in my personal opinion there arent new players who are going to join coz its a fan patch)
Then about the esoc maps , arent they more 1v1 oriented , what about team games considering both 2v2 and 3v3 as map size and resources should be different as per the game scenario.
Is this fan patch tad oriented only and keep nilla the same, or u planning to modify nilla as well.
Lastly, what about the cheaters, since this is a fan patch , basically a modded patch , eso would never care banning cheaters , atleast now we have a slight hope that cheaters do get banned for a week atleast like it happened in the case of moesbar,bpds and probably offence repeated could lead to a bigger ban.

An admin reply would be appreciated, thanks.
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Netherlands Goodspeed
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Post by Goodspeed »

shaolinstar wrote:
calmyourtits wrote:[ul type="disc"][li]Anyone is free to suggest changes but youd have to get creative to find a good one we havent yet thought of.[/li][/ul]
Whoa ! Im not sure whether its suprapretentious or just a trick to "prevent" [strike]peasants[/strike] people from contributing. :-X
Lets go with both? ')

People should be aware that, while we will read every suggestion, its unrealistic and counter-productive for us to respond to all of them. I remember last FP we got stuck in massive discussions about the changes and wasted a ton of time in the process.
But let me rephrase: Creative changes are preferred because that makes it more likely we havent already considered them. There arent that many obvious ways to fix a civ.
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Post by zoom »

shaolinstar wrote:
calmyourtits wrote:[ul type="disc"][li]Anyone is free to suggest changes but youd have to get creative to find a good one we havent yet thought of.[/li][/ul]
Whoa ! Im not sure whether its suprapretentious or just a trick to "prevent" [strike]peasants[/strike] people from contributing. :-X
Both. Its Goodspeed, after all...
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Italy Garja
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Post by Garja »

irage wrote:I had few questions about the fan patch ,
First of all how many players can u rope in to use the fan patch , there are a lot of people who don''t use the esoc community site, maybe like Japanese community, wont that reduce the number of games we already have , like lets say in qs or something. ( community will split and we obviously get lesser games, as in my personal opinion there arent new players who are going to join coz its a fan patch)
Then about the esoc maps , arent they more 1v1 oriented , what about team games considering both 2v2 and 3v3 as map size and resources should be different as per the game scenario.
Is this fan patch tad oriented only and keep nilla the same, or u planning to modify nilla as well.
Lastly, what about the cheaters, since this is a fan patch , basically a modded patch , eso would never care banning cheaters , atleast now we have a slight hope that cheaters do get banned for a week atleast like it happened in the case of moesbar,bpds and probably offence repeated could lead to a bigger ban.

An admin reply would be appreciated, thanks.


The number of players of any rank that will adopt the fan patch was one of our main concerns if not exactly the most important one. That''s why a poll. Not gonna lie, we''re pretty optimistic about that, as GS mentioned numbers are good (players activity, + members of the community, viewer count, etc.).
Japanese players did play the fan patch in the past. They even have a section on their site where you can download it and where you find the notes of the changes. I think they overall liked the idea but perhaps weren''t completely happy about all changes. Can''t blame them for that.
It''s easy to get in touch with them to promote the fan patch. Quicksearch will be availabe on the fan patch on ESOC maps (or perhaps even standard+esoc) and anyway changes will be limited so no drastic adaptation will be required. Most of changes are out of common sense afterall.
Also switching between official and fan patch will be merely a matter of clicking on a different icon, making it as easy as it can gets. In case of further patches in the future (to add maps or whatever) the update will be automatic just by launching the fan patch itself. Pretty much like the updates on eso.

As for maps, ESOC maps will be avaliable for rated games of course. And this means that they will be available for 1v1, team or FFA, just like other standard maps. It''s only a matter of time to convert them.
The patch is for TAD, nilla won''t be touched. Why Nilla anyway in 2015?

As for cheaters we can''t enforce bans, but who knows maybe Aizamk the wizard will make the impossible possible once again :)
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Poll: Would you play ESOC FP?

Post by [Armag] diarouga »

garja wrote:
irage wrote:I had few questions about the fan patch ,
First of all how many players can u rope in to use the fan patch , there are a lot of people who dont use the esoc community site, maybe like Japanese community, wont that reduce the number of games we already have , like lets say in qs or something. ( community will split and we obviously get lesser games, as in my personal opinion there arent new players who are going to join coz its a fan patch)
Then about the esoc maps , arent they more 1v1 oriented , what about team games considering both 2v2 and 3v3 as map size and resources should be different as per the game scenario.
Is this fan patch tad oriented only and keep nilla the same, or u planning to modify nilla as well.
Lastly, what about the cheaters, since this is a fan patch , basically a modded patch , eso would never care banning cheaters , atleast now we have a slight hope that cheaters do get banned for a week atleast like it happened in the case of moesbar,bpds and probably offence repeated could lead to a bigger ban.

An admin reply would be appreciated, thanks.

As for maps, ESOC maps will be avaliable for rated games of course. And this means that they will be available for 1v1, team or FFA, just like other standard maps. Its only a matter of time to convert them.

So the great garja will play rated again?
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Netherlands edeholland
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Post by edeholland »

diarouga wrote:
garja wrote:As for maps, ESOC maps will be avaliable for rated games of course. And this means that they will be available for 1v1, team or FFA, just like other standard maps. Its only a matter of time to convert them.

So the great garja will play rated again?



Another reason to vote yes.
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Post by bart331 »

the real question is how do you persuade the people responsible for the most games on eso to adopt it?

The nayuki, rafuuuu, piroshiki and other qs fanatics, tbh i think ppl from this site are only responsible for 10-15% of games played. Most ppl play for fun and are not interested in balance ( ppl laming shit out of ports for example) . So how are you gonna convince the ppls with more than 5 k games played on this patch?
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Tuvalu gibson
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Post by gibson »

bart331 wrote:the real question is how do you persuade the people responsible for the most games on eso to adopt it?

The nayuki, rafuuuu, piroshiki and other qs fanatics, tbh i think ppl from this site are only responsible for 10-15% of games played. Most ppl play for fun and are not interested in balance ( ppl laming shit out of ports for example) . So how are you gonna convince the ppls with more than 5 k games played on this patch?

I also feel like it isolates the jp community as they have practically 0 presence on this forum.
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Italy Garja
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Post by Garja »

bart331 wrote:the real question is how do you persuade the people responsible for the most games on eso to adopt it?

The nayuki, rafuuuu, piroshiki and other qs fanatics, tbh i think ppl from this site are only responsible for 10-15% of games played. Most ppl play for fun and are not interested in balance ( ppl laming shit out of ports for example) . So how are you gonna convince the ppls with more than 5 k games played on this patch?


We''re not, honestly. That''s exactly the target of players that a fan patch doesn''t aim for.
We are looking to involve players that use quicksearch and players that are not high ranked, but we don''t really care about players that are not minimally interested in balance and are also pretty anti-social. It''s not a big loss if you ask me. Most of other guys will adopt the fan patch as long as they will be aware of its existence.
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Post by deleted_user0 »

garja calling other people anti-social. I can die now, i have seen it all rofl
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Italy Garja
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Post by Garja »

umeu wrote:garja calling other people anti-social. I can die now, i have seen it all rofl
lol, and you speak of it? you''re almost the euro version of rafuuuu
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Palestine Mimsy for President
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Post by Mimsy for President »

garja wrote:
umeu wrote:garja calling other people anti-social. I can die now, i have seen it all rofl
lol, and you speak of it? youre almost the euro version of rafuuuu
I have no animosity toward umeu but THAT was funny :bravo:
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No Flag Good ol Ivan
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Poll: Would you play ESOC FP?

Post by Good ol Ivan »

diarouga wrote:
ivan wrote:Server bugs. I dont recall ESO population legitimately ever exceeding 5k
Nope, thats true.
http://www.agecommunity.com/_server_status_/pop.txt

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