Remove shooting ability of docks

[Dsy]

I think it is the one reason in the current meta why waterplay unbalanced. With scooners you can make lot of boats and once you running them into docks dock get 15damage/boats with 32 attacking range. (with 20 boats 300 damage, dock has 2500 health)
Its unfair vs a civ who cant really make boats(has no schooner card) cause you basicly cant go close to docks cause you get a lot of damage. It means scooner civ can be agressive and any time when warship run low health can run back for healing. If you health drop with no boat civ he can follow you until your ship is destroyed. Its simply unfair.

[Mimsy for President]

I think completely removing it is unfair too because making fishing boats has a cost and is a risk. I'm not against a nerf though. Nevertheless, sending advanced dock should bring it back as it is right now with advanced dock.

[KINGofOsmane]

You cant remove the dmg of docks.

[Dsy]

You could still send boats into docks so you can protect them...

[zoom]

Why not cap it instead of remove it? Removing features should be a last resort and avoided at all costs.

[Hazza54321]

think it should be much lower, if your opponent has done that well to win sea they must be able to take down the docks without losing too much

[Dsy]

Simple damage nerf is ok too. But need to decrease it drastrically then...

[Jaeger]

If youre the non schooners player, you can invest your wood in towers instead of fishing boats

[Dsy]

Towers dont gather anything...
If you want water defense you can invest outpost too as schooner civ. You can even build warships...

[Mimsy for President]

Did the frigates get nerfed btw ? Range and stuff like that.

[yemshi]

They did not.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Why lol. If you want to nerf the sea, nerf the freagates because they rape falcs.

[momuuu]

I dont like the shooting docks to be honest, it just annoys me.

[[Armag] diarouga]

I dont like the shooting docks to be honest, it just annoys me.

Then if you're going schooners and your opponent does 2 caravels 1st you've just lost the game?
It's just stupid lol. I mean you can nerf the water if you want, but be smart then, removing dock shooting ability would kill any water boom.

[momuuu]

That would be great.

[[Armag] diarouga]

That would be great.

Not at all. You don't want to kill the water.

[momuuu]

That would be great.

Not at all. You don't want to kill the water.

I do.

[hunter]

That would be great.

Not at all. You don't want to kill the water.

I do.

Care wall lamers might kill you

[zoom]

Why lol. If you want to nerf the sea, nerf the freagates because they rape falcs.

I don't think war-ships as such should be nerfed; "Off-Shore Support" and "Euro-Trash Cannons" home-city shipments should be nerfed and war- ship counters (defensive structures and artillery) buffed.

[[Armag] diarouga]

Why lol. If you want to nerf the sea, nerf the freagates because they rape falcs.

I don't think war-ships as such should be nerfed; "Off-Shore Support" and "Euro-Trash Cannons" home-city shipments should be nerfed and War Ship counters (defensive structures and artillery) buffed.

Well, even without any upgrades, freagates do too well vs falcs tbh.

[Mr_Bramboy]

I think it is the one reason in the current meta why waterplay unbalanced.

This is your problem. By assuming water play is unbalanced you're not going to improve in beating it. Land play is far superior, especially on ESOC Maps (yes, even on indonesia)

Try taking stagecoach and teching to skirm/goon/falc/culv on 3 tcs.

[pecelot]

PS. Indonesia doesn't have TPs

[WickedCossack]

Waterplay is unbalanced ???

TBH yea actually. Could use a buff now that I think about it.

What do you propose?

[pecelot]

removal of mortars' negative multiplier against warships
addition of monitors' negative multiplier against artillery

[Kaiserklein]

I had a good discussion with boneng about the patch and I kinda share his feeling. There should be more fish in esoc water maps, because the water boom in itself isn't a problem : it's just a boom, you can punish it. Schooners are maybe a bit too strong if anything, or maybe france and ger should have it, idk, but that's not at all the main issue anyway. The problem is atm, there probs isn't enough fish on most esoc maps to make the water boom viable, but you can still abuse offshore support. Offshore support and monitors are the main broken things in water play : a civ with offshore support can get complete control of the water abusing this card against artillery, and then once it can get monitors it just nukes everything on land. I believe monitors were already nerfed, but I think we should also do something about offshore support (not sure why though). And on the other hand, could add more fish/whales maybe, to make the boom more viable.