EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Discussions for the last iteration of EP.

Should European settlers be able to construct Town Centers like Warchief and Asian civilizations?

Yes
31
46%
No
36
54%
 
Total votes: 67

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Canada Mitoe
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EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by Mitoe »

Yay or nay? I feel like this is more relevant for team games than for 1v1.

This seems to be a discussion that comes up from time to time with most people leaning towards settlers being able to construct TCs.
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by Zutazuta »

No. I like the uniqueness of the mechanic. Maybe a build time nerf for non-Euros is appropriate instead?
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by fightinfrenchman »

No
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by howlingwolfpaw »

if you do that, better give natives factories
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by Kawapasaka »

TAD/TWC explorers generally need to stick with their armies and are more difficult to buy back. (Or have another important job, like Japan) Letting their vills construct TCs because of that might've been over-compensation, but this sounds like over-compensation in the opposite direction.
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by dutchdude117 »

I think either we give it to euro civs, OR we take it away from TAD civs. TWC civs are fine.
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by dutchdude117 »

Zutazuta wrote:No. I like the uniqueness of the mechanic. Maybe a build time nerf for non-Euros is appropriate instead?
perhaps we could give a build time buff to the euro explorer
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France [Armag] diarouga
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by [Armag] diarouga »

I'd be fine with it but it should be slower than the TAD building time.
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Czech Republic EAGLEMUT
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by EAGLEMUT »

This just seems like a nice QoL change.
It would also be quite helpful for scripting a better AI that can build/rebuild TCs.
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France chronique
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by chronique »

I prefere nerf the number of vili which can build a tc (like 6 max) to avoid some weird spam tc (from india).
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Latvia harcha
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by harcha »

I am for this change. We discussed this with @Kaiserklein in "the underrated case for forts" and in twitch chat.

My takeaways from these discussions was the following:
- the mechanic of only explorer being able to expand your economy would make sense if all explorers were equal, but this is not the case
- the price and speed of getting your explorer back varies and I don't want to change that
- taking the above into consideration euro settlers should be able to make TCs (as a side bonus this would also avoid the obvious explorer buyback which gives it away)
- the TCs currently go up too fast when you task 8 villagers (which you should because that is the safe option), so let us nerf the max builders limit to something like 4. further building time nerfs could be discussed after this change is implemented
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by RefluxSemantic »

I voted no. I just don't really see why this would make the game clearly better. It's a nice QoL change yes, but I think it might also have serious gameplay implications and I just don't see how this will make the game much better. So from a conservative point of view I decided to vote against the idea.
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Armenia Sargsyan
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by Sargsyan »

if you consider this then why dont you consider giving steel traps and amalgamation to the native civs ?
dumb change and as i can see there are a lot of reasonable ppl voting no
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Switzerland sebnan12
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by sebnan12 »

i dont think this is necessary. ive never seen a game where this was relevant..
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Norway aqwer
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by aqwer »

The irony is that the very people who were strongly against "Design changes" and stuff bcz it was getting away from RE, are suggesting such changes. So the real problem was to have the power of implementing changes than the changes itself.
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by RefluxSemantic »

aqwer wrote:The irony is that the very people who were strongly against "Design changes" and stuff bcz it was getting away from RE, are suggesting such changes. So the real problem was to have the power of implementing changes than the changes itself.
The big difference is that the community is now being consulted for all these changes in a good way. We don't get one google forms with questions that are way too long and extremely loaded. We get a simple poll to vote on a simple thing. Now the community seems to have an actual voice in design changes.
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France Rikikipu
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by Rikikipu »

I don't really see what problem it would solve to have this change implemented.

On the other hand, I find it interesting the way as it is right now. When you are in situations where you base trade a lot, for instance during water game, it requires skill to not get your explorers trapped or trap the explorer of your opponent.
France iNcog
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by iNcog »

Don't care either way, I've never had a problem putting down a TC with European civs and my opinion isn't relevant.
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by Hazza54321 »

sebnan12 wrote:i dont think this is necessary. ive never seen a game where this was relevant..
about every teamgame ever ^^
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by Hazza54321 »

i think either that or non buildable with nat/ asian , just think its fair that way.
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Switzerland sebnan12
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by sebnan12 »

Hazza54321 wrote:
sebnan12 wrote:i dont think this is necessary. ive never seen a game where this was relevant..
about every teamgame ever ^^
ive never seen an advanced race modus game where this was relevant*
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by howlingwolfpaw »

What is the purpose of changes like these? I watch many games, how many are decided upon this feature? what will it change? IMO, economies were designed to have timings for fast civs or some that peak a little later, these were scaled with TWC and TAD economies to keep them roughly in check (lookin at you China!) If you speed up the Euro bell curve its going to have butterfly effects, but really though, how many people go into age 3 and make a TC right away.
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Canada Mitoe
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Re: EP9: Should European settlers construct Town Centers?

Post by Mitoe »

@howlingwolfpaw Just as a quality of life change.

Anyway, seems to be far less popular than I had initially anticipated, so we won't be including this change.

Thanks everyone!

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