Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

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Spain MaxH
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Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

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Post by MaxH »

Hi, I wanted to suggest an idea regarding Rodeleros and get others' opinions on this. Rodeleros pretty much have 1 job and that's to kill cav. When facing other HI, they underperform unless they have greater numbers. Giving them a x1.25 multiplier against HI would allow them to last longer in engagements against HI but would not be enough to beat them.

For example, a Musketeer has enough time to fire 1 shot at a Rodelero before engaging in melee combat. After 1 shot fired it takes 15 hits for a Musketeer to kill a Rodelero and it takes 18 hits for a Rodelero to kill a Musketeer. A x1.25 multiplier against HI would reduce the number of hits it requires to kill a Musketeer to 14 hits.

Of course, en masse, Musketeers will still be able to win against Rodeleros because in a fight all the Musketeers will be able to engage the Rodeleros while some of the Rodeleros will still be trying to engage the Musketeers. However, this will at least help them last longer if a fight like this were to occur.

My hope is that something like this will help Rodelero's viability in early team games and make them less one-dimensional.

I would love to know other opinions on this.
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by duckzilla »

I like the idea, especially given that Rodeleros are more expensive than Musketeers and had been superior in melee before their attack stats were nerfed to the ground. It is also consistent with other coin-costing melee HI to beat musketeers in melee.
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No Flag uberjz
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

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Post by uberjz »

Great! Let's give the same x1.25 bonus to Changdao as well; it's only fair.
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Brazil Luciofrancosi
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by Luciofrancosi »

I like the idea.
I always found weird that rods were classed as anticav as historically they were dismissed because they would do really bad against cav.
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Germany Rohbrot
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by Rohbrot »

Luciofrancosi wrote:I like the idea.
I always found weird that rods were classed as anticav as historically they were dismissed because they would do really bad against cav.
Its cuz aoe3's coin costing melee infs do well vs cav not that they did care about history when making skull knights beating HC's.
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Australia Hazza54321
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

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Post by Hazza54321 »

Really bad idea as rods are already a great unit and can destroy goons unlike other heavy infantry. Would also make every spanish unit counter heavy infantry when u need heavy inf to block their melee comp
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France Guigs
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Post by Guigs »

Hazza54321 wrote:Really bad idea as rods are already a great unit and can destroy goons unlike other heavy infantry. Would also make every spanish unit counter heavy infantry when u need heavy inf to block their melee comp
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Canada dansil92
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by dansil92 »

rodeleros already soft counter a lot of heavy infantry, pikes, puma, war clubs, qiang, pretty even with changdao. if they beat musks too, like hazza said, then their cav and their melee inf would both counter heavy inf, which should be the standard counter to a cav-melee inf combo. since rods have such high armour and speed they already can punish out of position goons hard, which makes them especially strong
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France chronique
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by chronique »

I don't think spain need to be buff right now ^^
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Germany Rohbrot
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by Rohbrot »

dansil92 wrote:rodeleros already soft counter a lot of heavy infantry, pikes, puma, war clubs, qiang, pretty even with changdao. if they beat musks too, like hazza said, then their cav and their melee inf would both counter heavy inf, which should be the standard counter to a cav-melee inf combo. since rods have such high armour and speed they already can punish out of position goons hard, which makes them especially strong
Pumas win against age2 rods btw.
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No Flag Sergeant_Recker
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by Sergeant_Recker »

I think they don't? That's 40% melee resistance vs 20% melee resistance. So pretty sure rods beat all pike type units. Afaik, only melee heavy infantry units that beat rods are normally expensive than them, dopps, rajputs and halbs for example.
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by dansil92 »

Sergeant_Recker wrote:I think they don't? That's 40% melee resistance vs 20% melee resistance. So pretty sure rods beat all pike type units. Afaik, only melee heavy infantry units that beat rods are normally expensive than them, dopps, rajputs and halbs for example.
jpk definitely do, ive had to use them against rod-lancer, im pretty sure puma just lose or at least feel like they lose
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France Le Hussard sur le toit
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by Le Hussard sur le toit »

dansil92 wrote:
Sergeant_Recker wrote:I think they don't? That's 40% melee resistance vs 20% melee resistance. So pretty sure rods beat all pike type units. Afaik, only melee heavy infantry units that beat rods are normally expensive than them, dopps, rajputs and halbs for example.
jpk definitely do, ive had to use them against rod-lancer, im pretty sure puma just lose or at least feel like they lose
Jpk have a bonus against HI don't they ?
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by dansil92 »

Le Hussard sur le toit wrote:
dansil92 wrote:
Sergeant_Recker wrote:I think they don't? That's 40% melee resistance vs 20% melee resistance. So pretty sure rods beat all pike type units. Afaik, only melee heavy infantry units that beat rods are normally expensive than them, dopps, rajputs and halbs for example.
jpk definitely do, ive had to use them against rod-lancer, im pretty sure puma just lose or at least feel like they lose
Jpk have a bonus against HI don't they ?
yeah they absolutely crush other melee inf
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Spain EfraĆ­n
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by EfraĆ­n »

Rodelero needs a bit hp buff, not bonus.
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by EfraĆ­n »

chronique wrote:I don't think spain need to be buff right now ^^
I didn't know there was a patch where there was a buff for Spain.
Spain MaxH
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by MaxH »

EfraĆ­n wrote:Rodelero needs a bit hp buff, not bonus.
In my opinion, that would buff Rods against all other types of units which would be a little too much. A multiplier would be a more specific buff against HI.
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France chronique
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by chronique »

Rods don't need to be buff guys...
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

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Post by duckzilla »

but last time when I went 100% rod, I lost the game. so rods are too weak. get ur facts straight man
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by Squamiger »

It definitely makes no sense historically that rods counter cav and donā€™t counter heavy infantry. I think they were specifically used to counter pike formations. I always thought aoe3 should have a more reliable melee skirm like aom hypaspist
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by dansil92 »

Squamiger wrote:It definitely makes no sense historically that rods counter cav and donā€™t counter heavy infantry. I think they were specifically used to counter pike formations. I always thought aoe3 should have a more reliable melee skirm like aom hypaspist
while i 100% agree with you, it would be extremely silly to have both lancers and rods exactly overlap in role
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by Rohbrot »

dansil92 wrote:
Squamiger wrote:It definitely makes no sense historically that rods counter cav and donā€™t counter heavy infantry. I think they were specifically used to counter pike formations. I always thought aoe3 should have a more reliable melee skirm like aom hypaspist
while i 100% agree with you, it would be extremely silly to have both lancers and rods exactly overlap in role
Make lancers have multi against heavy cav, to not overlap. :grin:
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Vietnam duckzilla
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

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Post by duckzilla »

Rohbrot wrote:
dansil92 wrote:
Squamiger wrote:It definitely makes no sense historically that rods counter cav and donā€™t counter heavy infantry. I think they were specifically used to counter pike formations. I always thought aoe3 should have a more reliable melee skirm like aom hypaspist
while i 100% agree with you, it would be extremely silly to have both lancers and rods exactly overlap in role
Make lancers have multi against heavy cav, to not overlap. :grin:
Finally. Lancers should have a cav multiplier, since they attack with a lance, just like Cheyenne Riders. There is a reason for lances being used in joustings.
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United States of America Squamiger
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by Squamiger »

And they would then also be like their aom Greeks counterpart, the melee goon with a lance whose Greek name I forget
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Argentina Jotunir
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Re: Rodelero vs Heavy Infantry

Post by Jotunir »

Squamiger wrote:And they would then also be like their aom Greeks counterpart, the melee goon with a lance whose Greek name I forget
Prodromos.

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