October Update – Build # 46542

[Aizamk]

They're rewriting history now.

Hussar’s history section now correctly indicates that the unit is heavy cavalry instead of light cavalry.

CANCELLED

heavy cavalry armed with cold steel?

[helln00]

Bolas are going to be the new caro and Inca FI is going to be king. Maybe this is how the devs plan to dethrone the african civs, just make Inca great (not again)

15 range musk with range resist in age 4, aoe damage and snares at range, it counters both hand cav and goons, just slap on jungle bowman and a few abus and you can clear most things

[Garja]

Idk exactly how it will turn out but it's a massive rework for Inca and will most likely raise issues.
I don't get what was the problem with old Inca, at least I don't see why are so many changes needed.

[harcha]

yeah i felt like current inca was one of the more reasonable new civs. it was wonky but didn't stick out

[princeofcarthage]

They're rewriting history now.

Hussar’s history section now correctly indicates that the unit is heavy cavalry instead of light cavalry.

CANCELLED

This is not exactly accurate, cuz Hussars started as lightish cavalry and then quickly turned into heavy cavalry. Polish-Lithuanian Hussars which were very effective were heavier than traditional light cavalry. Hungarian hussars were to heavy cavalry in nature. During the reign of Fredrick the great and napoleon wars French and Prussia reorganized them into light cavalry for Prussian and French forces. So it is actually a mix n match. OG Aoe 3 also had Hussar as heavy cavalry.

[iNcog]

I'm quite glad with the Inca changes actually

[Seamonk]

They're rewriting history now.

Hussar’s history section now correctly indicates that the unit is heavy cavalry instead of light cavalry.

CANCELLED

This is not exactly accurate, cuz Hussars started as lightish cavalry and then quickly turned into heavy cavalry. Polish-Lithuanian Hussars which were very effective were heavier than traditional light cavalry. Hungarian hussars were to heavy cavalry in nature. During the reign of Fredrick the great and napoleon wars French and Prussia reorganized them into light cavalry for Prussian and French forces. So it is actually a mix n match. OG Aoe 3 also had Hussar as heavy cavalry.

Nah. For the time period we're looking at and the factions that get Hussar, they were used as light cavalry. The game is actually pretty bad at determining light/heavy cavalry. Hussar should be light (unless we're talking specifically Polish), there should be wider access to a cuirassier type heavy cavalry, dragoons shouldn't fire from horseback and be more of a medium cavalry when mounted. etc. etc.

The evolution to light cavalry happened in the 1600s, well before Napoleon and Frederick the Great.

[Dolphincup]

Bolas are going to be the new caro

This is where my mind went as well; bolas are basically caroleans that get a ranged snare for a 10% resource cost. After all shipments, bolas will get a couple points more in speed, and carolean will have ~20% hp over them. With no shipments, bolas are clearly better. The splash damage is where things become a bit unclear. I think to be safe the devs should keep bolas' current coin-heavy cost to prevent them from being too mass-able, or find a middle ground, like 50/55. Where bolas sit with these notes, I think they're over-tuned.

Here's the full comparison:

spoiler

Costs: (bolas +10%)
bolas: 65f / 45c
carolean: 60f / 40c

HP: (bolas -3%)
bolas: 175
carolean: 180 (with vet)

Ranged HP: (bolas + 21.5% until svea lifeguard comes in)
bolas: 218.75
carolean: 180

melee HP: (bolas - 22%)

With ranged snare, cav is the only kind of melee unit that can catch bolas

melee dmg to cav: (bolas -16%)
bolas: 20 dmg / 1.5 sec
carolean: 24 (vet) dmg / 1.5 sec
bolas get a 35% melee attack shipment in age IV, notably.

The ranged damage is where things become unclear.
ranged damage: (?)
bolas: 18 (x2 vs cav) dmg / 3 sec = 6 dps, or 12 dps (with splash 2)
carolean: 22.8 (x1.5 vs cav, vet) dmg / 2.5 sec = 9.1 dp, or 13.7 dps
If 2 splash equates to 1.5x damage, then we'd have something like +30% dmg for bolas against cav and even against infantry

bolas is still going to be very weak to cav in melee, but the ranged-snare helps them kite, and like caroleans, the ranged damage should be plenty to keep them off.
I think the splash should bring their damage to-par against infantry, and much better against cav than caroleans until platoon fire.

bolas warrior has 4 speed until road building comes in, then 4.4 ( at which point these guys are kiting monsters)
carolean has 4.25
In any case, ranged snare >> .25 speed.

Bolas have one 15% hp shipment
Caroleans have two 15% hp shipments, and ofc gets ranged resist with the second one.

bolas warriors have one 15% attack shipment,
caroleans get +10% attack and +.7 multiplier against cav w/ platoon fire.

[harcha]

They're rewriting history now.

Hussar’s history section now correctly indicates that the unit is heavy cavalry instead of light cavalry.

CANCELLED

This is not exactly accurate, cuz Hussars started as lightish cavalry and then quickly turned into heavy cavalry. Polish-Lithuanian Hussars which were very effective were heavier than traditional light cavalry. Hungarian hussars were to heavy cavalry in nature. During the reign of Fredrick the great and napoleon wars French and Prussia reorganized them into light cavalry for Prussian and French forces. So it is actually a mix n match. OG Aoe 3 also had Hussar as heavy cavalry.

Yeah it's not accurate, so what is the point of replacing a half-truth with a half-truth... I seem to remember that hussars were light cavalry by description on nilla. Either way the game intermixes heavy and hand cavalry and uses heavy/light completely differently than it would be accurate for military/historical purposes.

[aaryngend]

Exploit fixes
Fixed various exploits used by cheaters to gain an unfair advantage in multiplayer matches.

Wth is this refering to. Scary stuff.

[harcha]

Exploit fixes
Fixed various exploits used by cheaters to gain an unfair advantage in multiplayer matches.

Wth is this refering to. Scary stuff.

it means that they are working on anti-cheat. obviously they shouldn't go into details

[aaryngend]

Oh I know, and details should never be disclosed for the purpose of not spreading them, but I'm dying to know what kind of stupidity was possible with this geniusly coded game.

[harcha]

it might be as uninteresting as fixing the explorer revive bug

[gibson]

Oh I know, and details should never be disclosed for the purpose of not spreading them, but I'm dying to know what kind of stupidity was possible with this geniusly coded game.

I mean, people have found ways to cheat in the biggest multiplayer game titles, sometimes even on lan. Any game with a player base is gonna deal with cheaters, I’m just glad the devs have been able to keep it under control.

[Gimmick_aoe]

Thoughts @Gimmick_aoe ?

Tested like 6h , the civ seems overpowered.

Some build allows to have ageII 3.10 into 27v at 4.10.
Some build allows to get insane water boom scaling from wood upgrade age up.

I agree the civ had broken mechanics before but I think it's not getting any better.
The chimu "charge" ability allows chimus to run 7.88speed for 8seconds with speed card and not be snared during this right click.
The civ will be able to turtle even more because of kanchas acting like wood factories ageIII.

800 res + 3 lamas is too much for a start.

Kallanka ageII can bring broken rush in team because ally unit can garrison into kallanka and benefit from pop diminution aswell.

[yoqpasa]

I like the kancha BB change. Now it's not the standard age 1 BO but another way to boom. It's a mix between imperial bureaucracy (cost) and Otto consulate vills.
We should discuss about chimus snare removal. I guess they will not be as good raiding since players will save their ability for engagements. It's a pity they didn't remove the feature 100%.
Their 2 main units are cheaper now, seems too much. On the other side, no more 2 warhuts as soon as you hit colonial.

[speedflyer]

I'm quite glad with the Inca changes actually

Dont be glad , the civ is absolutely stupid tbh , it will ruin ladder again for months

[chronique]

Just asking, is Inca now better than first iteration of africans civ?

[Dolphincup]

IMO, every change they're making to Inca is well-reasoned, but a few too many changes are going a bit too far, and the combination might break things. 400w, 6 vill, 3 llama start might be okay, but alongside vill shipments, probably not.

I think a more reasonable start might be
300f
400w
0c
5 vill
4 llama (4 llama = 1 vill on plaza, which might actually be worth building at this point)

No vill shipments, but lower Queen's festival cost to 250 of each res.

Also I don't think the chimu snare-disable-ability should boost speed as well. should just release them from snares. that would be plenty.

EDIT: to disclose some biases of mine, I do feel like most civ should start with more wood b/c more wood means more options and therefore more strategic diversity, and very few civs should start with coin because it devaluates coin treasures, and it pigeonholes builds into age-1 market. Also feel like fewer civs should have age-1 vill shipments, but you can't really that away from any civ. So best not to give them vill shipments in the first place if possible.

[gibson]

It’s the speed doesn’t really matter, if you can’t get snared speed becomes a lot less relevant.

[Nojirex]

Not mentioned in the changelog but now Aztec starts with 2 Warrior Priests.

[Garja]

Lol random changes

[Nojirex]

Lol random changes

Any thoughts?

[Garja]

Idk, feels a bit random buff but then again Aztecs aren't very competitive.
Everything just feels very random. I guess they want to try out new stuff but it becomes a mess very quickly.

[helln00]

2 warrior priest does mean that aztec have an exp trickle that is better then TP right at the start of the game so ealier 3 vils and easier to get to max warrior priest in age 2 as well. might be decent in boosting their lategame age 2 eco.