Public Update Preview - June Update

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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

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Post by lenlenlena3 »

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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by Kanoo »

leg[] wrote:
15 Jun 2022, 22:39
Is FPS lag and lack of responsiveness during larger battles on the screen even a real problem? Oris there something where it's just me. Sometimes it seems like frames just drop especially in times when it's a big battle with 4 or more players. Of course things are still happening, but it's like the screen is not responding so you just have to deal with the lag, then you get a slideshow and units are just dying randomly. I don't see if they are working on that, or if it's even considered a problem.
Yeah, I've had this problem since the last two patches even while playing skirmish tbh. Didn't have this occur earlier.
thebritish wrote:
19 Jan 2016, 09:58
So, you are saying that if i watch H20's rec, i can beat anyone below H20's level because i know his BO?
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by EAGLEMUT »

Another update is in:

June Update – Build # 13.12015
  • Fixed a few more bugs with the new Age Up button
  • Fixed a crash when toggling fullscreen while customizing Explorer in HC
  • Fixed the upgrade strings for the Tatar Archer
  • Fixed legendary status names for Tatar Archer and Qizilbash
  • Fixed an issue with Old Ways technologies not working properly for the NA Civilizations
  • Tengri Wind Horses technology now properly decreases ROF for ranged attack for Cavalry Archer units
  • Tycoon - fix for Age and Revolt challenges not being visible after loading a save game
  • Fixed an issue where the Game Summary screen was showing incorrect settings after loading a save game
  • Fix an issue displaying mod thumbnails when the temp folder path contains a non-ASCII character
  • Fix for mod thumbnail not showing up for local mods when the user folder contains a non-ASCII character
Seems they're finally looking into issues with non-ASCII mod paths. However, the main issue is mods can't be downloaded at all with non-ASCII user folder, hopefully a fix for that will be included.
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by leg[] »

Challenger_Marco wrote:
16 Jun 2022, 07:32
Why do i have to re-learn the game everytime i play after taking months break?
I would argue logically, you don't truly care nor are a top player if you just do only 1 thing and think it will never change. Great players will likely change their strategies to win, or see things other didn't see. They would care to see how the change impacts things, even if it's just a casual glance.

If Lakota ended up being stronger, that is the only thing I see possibly, but I highly doubt it changed too much.

In a game like aoe3, it's been stagnant with little changes (in fact I didn't play it much on the original versions, then played some later when DE came out). But in many games (even by the original creators), a build order is only like the first 5 minutes of the game. Any non-mentally impaired person will very likely choose a better build order,beyond that you have to still learn other skills to have a higher chance to win, because any monkey can follow a BO. So why complaining about that? You should still win unless you are a monkeybrain. There are a lot of civs that are fun and playable but probably wouldn't be beating any top players: for example, Lakota which can still win games but has been a D or C tier civ with potential imo/
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

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Post by Kaiserklein »

lenlenlena3 wrote:
16 Jun 2022, 12:18
made a clip -> posted in discord -> confirmed they were tracking the bug that causes your explorer to stop walking halfway, when building tp and the same with the dock -> next patch hopefully fixed.
If you guys want bugs fixed, take clip post it in discord they will respond and work on it ASAP. I used to be like you guys and complain a lot, till I realised i'm part of the problem. The developers are good, only so much they can do though, when it comes to finding every single bug in this game themselves.
There are bugs I've reported literally upon launch in that big thread I made, and that still aren't fixed.
I used to be like you, until I realized I was wasting my time because they're the core of the problem
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by iNcog »

lenlenlena3 wrote:
16 Jun 2022, 12:27
iNcog wrote:
15 Jun 2022, 12:33
So Lakota more broken now. Ugh why are they doing this with the game. :/ It's so gimmicky instead of solid, good design.

I did name my dog lakota though.
It actually feels like with the lakota rework and all of the previous civilization reworks they are trying to make the game and these civilizations more well rounded and balanced, instead of just giving each individual civilization overpowered stuff and trying to balance it that way. It seems to me that they're actually actively attempting to reach a solid design, re creating civilizations that are refreshing and can do more and don't just have insane high and low spikes or feel one dimensional. It's funny you say lakota has a solid design tho because ever since i've played DE all i've heard is 80% of the aoe 3 players i've interacted with complaining about their terrible design, begging for a rework.
My bad, allow me to clarify. Lakota design has always been broken, just like Ottoman and Inca (to name a few civs off the top of my head). These are civilizations that were broken just by how they were designed. I'm not sure what made Lakota the way it was, but it was definitely off compared to normal baseline civilizations like India, France, British, etc.

So, I agree that it's good that they're reworking the civilizations. But they seem to be introducing more gimmicks than not.

If I'm being frank, I loved the design of the African civilizations when they were released. They were horribly overbalanced, but I really liked the way that they worked. I think the livestock market was thoughtful, as well as the influence mechanic (assuming I'm even remembering the name properly). The Ethiopian mortar is stupid and broken though. Hausa is a ton of fun to play. It definitely felt like AOE3. Sweden, imo, was also relatively well designed. They were quirky but it wasn't really out there.

Inca? The whole stronghold thing should have been removed. USA? No idea what was going on with the design of that civilization. They went way too far and it felt like playing a mod, not classic AOE3. Tower defense USA is just not fun to play against, though I still want to give props to Lionheart for developing the play style itself, because Lionheart is just a chad gentleman.

I didn't touch the Mexico DLCs nor have I even been interested in trying the Italian and Maltese civilizations. There's no point in playing online if it's just a race to find the lamest strategy and exploiting it until the devs balance it. For now, as an outsider, it seems that the game is a constant state of imbalance and gimmicks. Mechanics and other fun things don't seem to matter as much as just finding a good (/lame) build and doing that. I was never big on build crafting, so the game really isn't for me as of now.

I don't mean to bitch too much and I don't want to shit on the game either. But I also may as well give my candid thoughts on the matter.
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Garja wrote:
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

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Post by JKProwler »

I don't knoe about everyone else, but I feel the balance is the best it's ever been on DE.

I feel like I now have a chance to beat any civ at my level on QS, unlike before when I played against certain civs where I knew what was coming and there was nothing I can do to stop it.

There's still small civ favoured matchups but overall balance is good atm
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by JKProwler »

Kaiserklein wrote:
16 Jun 2022, 17:21
lenlenlena3 wrote:
16 Jun 2022, 12:18
made a clip -> posted in discord -> confirmed they were tracking the bug that causes your explorer to stop walking halfway, when building tp and the same with the dock -> next patch hopefully fixed.
If you guys want bugs fixed, take clip post it in discord they will respond and work on it ASAP. I used to be like you guys and complain a lot, till I realised i'm part of the problem. The developers are good, only so much they can do though, when it comes to finding every single bug in this game themselves.
There are bugs I've reported literally upon launch in that big thread I made, and that still aren't fixed.
I used to be like you, until I realized I was wasting my time because they're the core of the problem
I think the initial launch was a disaster. If u provided them with a million list to fix, I doubt they would had time to go through each list while dealing with other critical issues.

Now that the game is in a stable state, probably good time to highlight some of the remaining bug issues.

Problem with balance suggestions tho is it seems everyone has a different opinion which might be harder to get through to the devs.

Pathing is also probably a bug that will never be able to be totally eliminated entirely just because of the countless of variables that would cause a unit to path in a certain way...but maybe specifying a specific pathing scenario might be the way to go.
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by lenlenlena3 »

I can only be an advocate based on my experience. a) I think posting in discord is the way to go and not in threads, I posted long list in a thread once before too and it was left unseen. As soon as I started posting about bugs in Discord over the last year, which they also recommended to do, they always responded and say they're working on it. Again this is my experience, hence why I simply cannot say anything bad about them working on an issue I or people I know have addressed.
b) Next to posting in discord, I think providing clips is very important so they actually see what the hell you are actually talking about and will probably save them a lot of time.

Now that aside I do want to clarify that i'm not living in fairy land, some bugs have been here since launch. YEARS AGO. They are annoying and triggering as hell and should have been seen or fixed ages ago especially bugs introduced through patches and never left or were mentioned in threads by multiple people during that time.

Obviously no one should have to do this but I figured, if you have time and care rather than complaing about a bug for 2 years straight like me, I should just clip it and send it to the discord and if everyone did it that way, there is absolutely no way they would not see or fix it, based on my so far experience atleast.
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by lenlenlena3 »

JKProwler wrote:
17 Jun 2022, 02:07
Kaiserklein wrote:
16 Jun 2022, 17:21
lenlenlena3 wrote:
16 Jun 2022, 12:18
made a clip -> posted in discord -> confirmed they were tracking the bug that causes your explorer to stop walking halfway, when building tp and the same with the dock -> next patch hopefully fixed.
If you guys want bugs fixed, take clip post it in discord they will respond and work on it ASAP. I used to be like you guys and complain a lot, till I realised i'm part of the problem. The developers are good, only so much they can do though, when it comes to finding every single bug in this game themselves.
There are bugs I've reported literally upon launch in that big thread I made, and that still aren't fixed.
I used to be like you, until I realized I was wasting my time because they're the core of the problem
I think the initial launch was a disaster. If u provided them with a million list to fix, I doubt they would had time to go through each list while dealing with other critical issues.

Now that the game is in a stable state, probably good time to highlight some of the remaining bug issues.

Problem with balance suggestions tho is it seems everyone has a different opinion which might be harder to get through to the devs.

Pathing is also probably a bug that will never be able to be totally eliminated entirely just because of the countless of variables that would cause a unit to path in a certain way...but maybe specifying a specific pathing scenario might be the way to go.
Yeah some things they seem to have trouble fixing, no idea why exactly but I just remember when they tried to fix the cannons unpacking, it was a nice effort but it was like putting a plaster on a gunshot wound. But stuff like tp bug, spectatormode, various crashes, the waiting for players, not being able to type in chat, units getting stuck etc they can work on, which they partially have.
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by fitzbro »

RIP Lakota
When in doubt, teepee out!
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by ShinkuroYukinari »

fitzbro wrote:
17 Jun 2022, 04:59
RIP Lakota
Uhhh, wat?
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by helln00 »

ShinkuroYukinari wrote:
17 Jun 2022, 07:31
fitzbro wrote:
17 Jun 2022, 04:59
RIP Lakota
Uhhh, wat?
Yeah Lakota infantry FI here I come
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by iron_turtle »

Going by Aiz's stream, Clubby bois are the new marines, no more TCs and FB in age3.
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by Kaiserklein »

JKProwler wrote:
17 Jun 2022, 02:07
I think the initial launch was a disaster. If u provided them with a million list to fix, I doubt they would had time to go through each list while dealing with other critical issues.
They could (should) be tracking them all internally. Could have been fixed over time.
JKProwler wrote:
17 Jun 2022, 02:07
Now that the game is in a stable state, probably good time to highlight some of the remaining bug issues.
I've invested a lot of time making that list already, posting other bug threads, giving feedback / ideas about balance... It just doesn't seem to pay off and I'm not willing to spend any extra time into this.
JKProwler wrote:
17 Jun 2022, 02:07
Problem with balance suggestions tho is it seems everyone has a different opinion which might be harder to get through to the devs.
Problem is they're too busy randomly reworking civs or adding gimmicky stuff to actually balance the game. Obviously very hard to do both at the same time.
Also despite "consulting" some top players, they didn't really listen to the feedback and ideas so much. I think the only thing I can really be satisfied about is my russian suggestions they finally implemented, so now russia finally seems rather balanced, and has other options than the bot 14 rush. But it took so long for them to finally listen, we had stupid buffs like 10 pop bhs before that, etc.
JKProwler wrote:
17 Jun 2022, 02:07
Pathing is also probably a bug that will never be able to be totally eliminated entirely just because of the countless of variables that would cause a unit to path in a certain way...but maybe specifying a specific pathing scenario might be the way to go.
Well yeah, they messed up with it and I don't think they'll ever be able to fix it back. Even going back to a legacy level of pathing would be an improvement lol. And that means a lot when you know how bad the pathing already was on legacy.
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by Narida »

iNcog wrote:
16 Jun 2022, 21:00

If I'm being frank, I loved the design of the African civilizations when they were released. They were horribly overbalanced, but I really liked the way that they worked. I think the livestock market was thoughtful, as well as the influence mechanic (assuming I'm even remembering the name properly). The Ethiopian mortar is stupid and broken though. Hausa is a ton of fun to play. It definitely felt like AOE3. Sweden, imo, was also relatively well designed. They were quirky but it wasn't really out there.

Inca? The whole stronghold thing should have been removed. USA? No idea what was going on with the design of that civilization. They went way too far and it felt like playing a mod, not classic AOE3. Tower defense USA is just not fun to play against, though I still want to give props to Lionheart for developing the play style itself, because Lionheart is just a chad gentleman.
The livestock market was indeed a good idea, but in practice it doesn't work well because its too hard to balance around livestock maps.

Having civs that are good on certain maps like (otto on tp maps, or port on water maps) only makes sense for competitive settings because you cant play a civ that's too map dependent in QS and the whole lobby system is still a mess.

The influence thing I entirely disagree with I think it is the biggest bastard to have been introduced in the whole of DE. The last thing this game needed was a 6th resource that's basically just a knock off of export, and export already never made sense and was I think one of the worst additions of TAD.

It also made the civ even much more map dependent because you need TPs. Artillery costing influence is just sloppy and lazy design because it means you can train it without access to coin mines which upsets the whole push and pull for map control balance that AOE should be about IMO.

Sweden although it is very fun and one of my favorite civs to play as a design is undoubtedly a failure.

- The whole merc thing never worked out at all and would require at least a dozen changes (I hope they dont attempt it).
- Its another relatively map dependent civ because you need coin mines.
- The civ is much to much based around Caroleans. Even though I know there are plenty of other strats and comps you can go for they are undoubtedly worse in 95% of scenarios.
- The whole original idea that Caroleans where some adaptable unit that could be teched into the direction you wanted (platoon fire, to make it proper anticav and snaplock and svea to make it a pseudo skirm), or that could fullfill different roles in different stances also did not end up working at all.

One change that could be good is to make torps wood gather rate better, so that they are less map dependent and you can more easily go for xb pike or leathers or jaegers that cost wood (lul).
However I think Sweden is in a decent spot balance wise and giving them another buff might be a bad idea.

About Lakota removing both vil shipments seems like overkill, the only silver lining is that with an early food or wood treasure you can probably start tp quite easily which would be a very significant buff. Maybe you can even send spice trade as well as GH or something to make up.
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by JKProwler »

^^that's fair. Didn't know how much you invested already to try get things right. So can understand ur frustrations.

Good thing they are still continuing to enhance and support the game. The game is in a much better state than a year ago. Now we just hope they start to listen more to some top players recommendations.

I personally hope they bring back PR ranks and lobby ranked team games. That's something I really missed from legacy...and a site where we can look back at data for players past matches
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by iNcog »

Narida wrote:
18 Jun 2022, 11:23
iNcog wrote:
16 Jun 2022, 21:00

If I'm being frank, I loved the design of the African civilizations when they were released. They were horribly overbalanced, but I really liked the way that they worked. I think the livestock market was thoughtful, as well as the influence mechanic (assuming I'm even remembering the name properly). The Ethiopian mortar is stupid and broken though. Hausa is a ton of fun to play. It definitely felt like AOE3. Sweden, imo, was also relatively well designed. They were quirky but it wasn't really out there.

Inca? The whole stronghold thing should have been removed. USA? No idea what was going on with the design of that civilization. They went way too far and it felt like playing a mod, not classic AOE3. Tower defense USA is just not fun to play against, though I still want to give props to Lionheart for developing the play style itself, because Lionheart is just a chad gentleman.
The livestock market was indeed a good idea, but in practice it doesn't work well because its too hard to balance around livestock maps.

Having civs that are good on certain maps like (otto on tp maps, or port on water maps) only makes sense for competitive settings because you cant play a civ that's too map dependent in QS and the whole lobby system is still a mess.

The influence thing I entirely disagree with I think it is the biggest bastard to have been introduced in the whole of DE. The last thing this game needed was a 6th resource that's basically just a knock off of export, and export already never made sense and was I think one of the worst additions of TAD.

It also made the civ even much more map dependent because you need TPs. Artillery costing influence is just sloppy and lazy design because it means you can train it without access to coin mines which upsets the whole push and pull for map control balance that AOE should be about IMO.

Sweden although it is very fun and one of my favorite civs to play as a design is undoubtedly a failure.

- The whole merc thing never worked out at all and would require at least a dozen changes (I hope they dont attempt it).
- Its another relatively map dependent civ because you need coin mines.
- The civ is much to much based around Caroleans. Even though I know there are plenty of other strats and comps you can go for they are undoubtedly worse in 95% of scenarios.
- The whole original idea that Caroleans where some adaptable unit that could be teched into the direction you wanted (platoon fire, to make it proper anticav and snaplock and svea to make it a pseudo skirm), or that could fullfill different roles in different stances also did not end up working at all.

One change that could be good is to make torps wood gather rate better, so that they are less map dependent and you can more easily go for xb pike or leathers or jaegers that cost wood (lul).
However I think Sweden is in a decent spot balance wise and giving them another buff might be a bad idea.

About Lakota removing both vil shipments seems like overkill, the only silver lining is that with an early food or wood treasure you can probably start tp quite easily which would be a very significant buff. Maybe you can even send spice trade as well as GH or something to make up.
Agree to disagree, I appreciate your take on things.

I've never had an issue with African civilizations getting artillery through influence because you can't spam artillery like French, Dutch or Brits. You get some artillery to work with and you'd better not lose it. Not to mention you don't get African mamelukes and other goodies if you decide to spend your influence that way. The mortar was appalling though.

You say Sweden is poorly designed but it's also very fun and one of your favorites to play. I've never personally felt frustrated with Swedish design because you can shut down Torps with good map control (which is good design imo). It encourages player interaction. Unlike a civilization like the USA that is more than happy to sit behind walls, outposts and artillery. They don't make units and that's as much as you can do against them.

Swedish mercs are like Germany mercs imo. It's something they can do but it's not necessarily the best option, which is how it should be, realistically. Unlike the USA cowboy charged attack bullshit which really just shouldn't be in the game.

Export is fine as a mechanic imo, like influence you basically just to pick up an upgrade or set of units throughout the game, it's like a mini home city.

Otto on TP or Port on water are realistically sort of broken by design, just looking at how you always had port on a water map and how lame those games were to watch in a tournament setting.

There's no question that there are a lot of things in AoE3 that are just broken. RE: Lakota changes. They don't seem to be good from what I can read in this thread, they seem like a wild attempt at improving things by going for whacky design instead of a more normalized approach. They could have made Lakota similar to France or Germany but without the need to build houses. Instead they took a step in the opposite direction. Eh.
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Garja wrote:
20 Mar 2020, 21:46
I just hope DE is not going to implement all of the EP changes. Right now it is a big clusterfuck.
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by Darwin_ »

My biggest concern with the reworked RE civs and the new DLC civs is that their designs are complicated in ways that don't add much strategic depth.

Even if the main goal of the devs now is to make the game as compelling as possible for casual players (a goal I don't find disagreeable at this point), I still would have a problem with their design choices. The most loved civs in any strategy game, from RTSs to 4X games, are the civs that are unique, have a strong internal narrative (i.e. a clear raison d'etre), and have high levels of internal synergy. Japan in AoE3, for example, has probably the strongest cult following of any civ in the game, and for a clear reason: its mechanics are unique, its features strongly suggest (but don't force) a specific playstyle, and its unique elements have compelling synergy.

Just throwing content at a civ doesn't make it better. The content has to fit within a narrative and strategic framework. I think the best example of added content is Spanish Gold from EP. It was a much needed element of uniqueness for an otherwise bland civ, yet it didn't feel out of place and synergized really well with the civ's existing mechanics (faster shipments, focus on fortress play) in a way that was both unobtrusive yet pushed players to explore new playstyles.

The best content presents a player with a choice. Think about the choice Japan has between Kami and 3 boats, Brits with VC and 3v, or (to go back to Spain) Spanish Gold or a shipment with more immediate pay-off. But that choice needs to have real consequences and no obvious answer. However, sometimes the most compelling decisions are the ones with pretty simple choices, like sending an age 2 combat card or 700c and aging up. I think the politician changes in the Smackdown Patch back in the day were a great example of how civs can be dramatically changed and made much more strategically compelling just by slightly tweaking a few numbers.

This Lakota rework is just too hodgepodge, and probably just too complicated in general. The teepee rework (and the accompanying counter-nerfs) is probably all that the civ really needs for supremacy. It fits within the mobile/fluid playstyle of the civ very well, is unique yet not too unobtrusive (unlike when auras could stack in EP), and relies on an existing element of the civ.

I feel similarly about the new DLC civs, especially Mexico, US, and the KoTM civs; all of them could have much of their fluff removed and if anything be more strategically compelling. The African civs too probably could have been simplified pretty significantly (like removing or dramatically reworking the Influence mechanic) and would still be super interesting and fun to play. Influence is just kind of a bad mechanic (like export), there are too many Federal States and their cards are just a bit too complicated, and Italy, Malta, and Sweden have just a bit too much going on and what they do have just doesn't work very synergistically.
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by helln00 »

iNcog wrote:
18 Jun 2022, 14:12
There's no question that there are a lot of things in AoE3 that are just broken. RE: Lakota changes. They don't seem to be good from what I can read in this thread, they seem like a wild attempt at improving things by going for whacky design instead of a more normalized approach. They could have made Lakota similar to France or Germany but without the need to build houses. Instead they took a step in the opposite direction. Eh.
Ironically a lot of these changes are similar to what esoc tried to do in the past, they seem to be trying that an trying to learn a few lessons from it (the tepee eco changes)

I think they are sort of on the right track - they have removed the buff stacking that made it so imbalance and made their eco alot more flexible.

The only thing that is the sticking point i think is the removal of the 5 vil card in age 2. Arguably if it was brought back or say turn into 4 vils instead I think the civ is soild
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by Garja »

eco teepee was a bad change anyway
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Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

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Post by callentournies »

imagine thinking africa civs are overnerfed
If I were a petal
And plucked, or moth, plucked
From flowers or pollen froth
To wither on a young child’s
Display. Fetch
Me a ribbon, they, all dead
Things scream.
Rainbow Land callentournies
Howdah
Posts: 1676
Joined: May 6, 2021
ESO: esuck

Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by callentournies »

merc shipments are strong, right? Imagine a civ that can just send 7x merc shipments in a row, and they afford this without spending a single cent from their food/wood/coin bank, so they also make units too
If I were a petal
And plucked, or moth, plucked
From flowers or pollen froth
To wither on a young child’s
Display. Fetch
Me a ribbon, they, all dead
Things scream.
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Serbia ShinkuroYukinari
Dragoon
Posts: 423
Joined: Apr 27, 2019
ESO: ShinkuroYukinari
Clan: BANIN

Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by ShinkuroYukinari »

callentournies wrote:
18 Jun 2022, 22:45
imagine thinking africa civs are overnerfed
callentournies wrote:
18 Jun 2022, 22:54
merc shipments are strong, right? Imagine a civ that can just send 7x merc shipments in a row, and they afford this without spending a single cent from their food/wood/coin bank, so they also make units too
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What did I miss?
My signature was removed, MOD ABUSE!
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Argentina EliteRifleman
Dragoon
Posts: 354
Joined: Jan 24, 2021
ESO: EliteRifleman
Clan: SpNz

Re: Public Update Preview - June Update

Post by EliteRifleman »

Now lakota start with 400 f 200 w and 100c in crates
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