Sweden Jaeger semi FF
Sweden Jaeger semi FF
EDIT: it came to my attention (yes, I'm nub) that Sweden always start with Jaegers and Black riders at the tavern. This makes the guide in part obsolete.
Instead of using the church tech or the jaeger card, now it makes more sense to just build a tavern from the 700w card and train Jaegers from there (4torp, 700c, 700w becomes the main build).
Key cards in age3 still are (in no specific order) 1k wood, 1k coin, 2falcs, 5hakkas, 5huss, 3mines
This guide aims to complement the strategic options of Swedes, in order to address MUs where going for carolean based play is not effective (mostly against semi FF civs that go for skirm/goon).
Specifically, it involves a stable start and the use of Jaegers and Hakkapelits.
There are many build orders that can be crafted around this strategic idea, but I'll present four of them which I believe are the most effective and efficient (also relatively simple).
All these builds work better with a TP start, which means a 16v age up. With 2 torps you can often age with 15v, but the shipment progression will be significantly worse to the point that some builds just don't work in practice.
The deck includes some cards that allow ageII play with caroleans if the opponent rushes you. 600w, 3huss, 2LC can all be replaced by eco/army upgrades if that's not a concern.
Build order reference
Basic build
|4torps | 700c | 700w | 10 jaegers | 2 falcs | 1k coin | 1k wood |
Quick timings and smooth follow up. Good eco but it depletes the first mine relatively early.
2 Falc build
|4torps | 700c | 700w | 2 falcs | 1k coin | 10jaegers | 1k wood |
2 falcs out quick, jaegers at about 12 min. Timings resemble an otto jan FF. Good eco, doesn't deplete the first mine as fast. It is the most intuitive to perform.
Church card build
|4torps | 700c | 700w | church card | 1k wood |
6 improved jaegers out fast. Not as smooth and easy to macro as the coin builds. Early eco not great but better follow up.
600c Build
|4torps | 700c | 600c | 10jaegers | 1k wood |
10 jaegers as first card in age3. Easy to macro, doesn't deplete the first mine as fast. Poor eco, safer vs age2 pressure.
Build order by age
All builds are basically identical for the first 7 minutes. The church build is slightly more efficient with torps on trees rather than on coin mines but it works either way.
Age1
3 vills shoot an animal and 3 collect the crates. Build a torp while the explorer collects treasures and goes to build the most convenient TP. Ideally find a wood treasure otherwise you have to chop 40w. Mind your macro in the first 2 TC cycles, Swedes start with only 150f so getting no idle TC is not trivial. Also when torps are built on mines, mind the berry bush spawn so it won't block the villager pathing.
The first card is 3 vills. Age up with 2 vills and 2 cows.
Transition to age2
Move all vills to chop wood while two of them also bring hunts closer to the TC. The goal is to build 2 torps and collect 200w for the stable. The 2 torps can be placed on the first mine (more efficient but they will be useless eventually) or on far mines (less efficient but will work for longer). Either way keep the second mine clear for the 4torp card. After the 2 torps are built switch 6 vills on coin. Then the rest on food when you have 200w. Keep minding the hunting work until both hunts are inside TC range.
Age2
Send 4torp wagons and build the stable with food vills. Kill the cows between torps to automatically collect the food. Use the 4 torp wagons on the 2nd mine (mind their pathing for max efficiency).
Send 700c and set the eco shipment point on a torp so that crates will be automatically collected. TC rally point is on food. If you macroed well you should be ready to click the age up button (fast age) exactly when the coin crates expire (6:50-7:00).
Transition to age3
The follow up depends on the strategy:
- for the Basic Build send 700w and use it to build torps on farther out mines. Building a market is also an option but it's not key at this point. A 2nd TP or a barracks might also be an option if you
expect pressure and can't build extra torps on distant mines. Move all vills to coin to collect 900c for the 10 Jaegers.
- for the 2 Falc build send 700w and build torps. Keep 10 vills on food and rest on coin (in this case you can spread vills on other mines to make torps gather longer). TC Rally point is on wood.
- for the church card build send 700w and build a church. Keep 10 vills on food and rest on coin with TC rally point to wood. Spare wood for the Jaeger church tech.
- for the 600c build send 600c and leave 10 vill on food while rest on coin. Again rally point is on wood.
Age3
- with the Basic build send 10jaegers as soon as you have the card and 900c. Then move about 10v on food and rest stay on coin. Rally point is on wood. Make Hakkapelits until you have enough wood to drop a rax. Usually that comes with 1k wood, since it's hard to make extra jaegers early on and dropping more torps with the chopped wood is preferable. Hakkas are also needed to defend the 2 falcs which is usually a good card to send at this point. After that 1k coin is often useful to help making more Jaegers and works as a skirm card. The cards you should focus next are cav combat, 3 mines or even the church card to switch the Jaeger macro to wood/coin. Usually you make a market and more torps with 1k wood. Later when your eco feels solid and you have a decent number of vills on wood you can drop an arsenal and get all the advanced upgrades for skirms and ranged cav. If you spare wood, work on getting TPs and stagecoach and/or a 2nd TC.
- with the 2 falc build things come quite natural. You will be making Hakkapelits while sending 2 falcs. Then 1k coin next and will use that to send 10jaegers. The 1k wood as next card will be used for infrastructure such as a rax, market+upgrades and more torps. The follow up is similar to the Basic build.
- with the Church card build you start making Hakkapelits and then move some vills on wood while sending the Church card. The goal is to get 750w for the Jaeger tech. Can also macro the other way around if you notice the church card will be ready as soon as you reach age3. After that you usually still make Hakkapelits (need about 10-12 vills on food) and send 1k wood to get extra torps+rax or 2 falcs to push. The follow up is similar to the basic build but you will have to macro all 3 resources. However mines will last longer and eventually your eco will feel more solid as a result of less idle vills wandering around the map and less idle torps.
- with the 600c build you will have easier time collecting 900c for 10 jaegers. However because of no torping in transition you won't have the card instantly ready in age3. The follow up is the same as usual but with one more card spent on a somewhat mediocre shipment which eventually results in less eco.
Some tips:
- after early age3 you don't usually need a lot of food. For the same reason steel traps is not a priority at all. On the other hand, the 2nd wood upgrade is often useful, especially after getting the jaeger church tech
- try to spread out vills on farther mines whenever possible to make torps last longer
- don't hesitate to trade food for gold at the market to complete a jaeger batch in early age3. While this is normally very unefficient, it still holds quite a strategic value so it's worth the extra resources
- keep an eye on the amount of coin each mine has. Try to deplete 2 or more at the same time when you plan to send the 3 mine card
- jaegers are already premium units. This means you dont't need unit upgrades as soon as other civs do. Instead your cards will focus on improving your eco/durability of torps. Eventually you get unit ups from the advanced arsenal and cav cards.
- since jaegers win almost any skirm battle, you usually don't need to hussar switch. Occasionally switching to hussar can be good to add some body block to your combo or simply to remacro an excess of food/shortage of coin
Suggested card order for some specific MUs:
French
French are the baseline semi FF civ against which I'd just do the standard build (4torp, 700c, 700w). Sometimes you may want to swap 700w for 700c in case of aggressive play from the opponent but I'd try to stick to 700c as second card and age up, while defending with only hussar and minutemen if possible.
In age3, I'd still wait for the 1k coin card to make jaegers from the tavern. This way you don't deplete the close mines too fast and don't hinder the production from stable which is also important in early fortress. It's also the easiest way to macro. Anything else that follows depends on the situation but should come natural.
Germans
Against a standard German uhlan semi FF, a mix of huss and hakkas + later jaegers should work well and possibly better than hakkas+jaegers in early age3. The card order after the standard age2 agenda should be something like 5hakkas, 5huss, 1k coin, etc. with focus on cav up cards. When starting huss vs Germans it is important to mind vill protection and the use of minutemen since Germans outmass your cav with uhlans. It is also important for the same reason and because it is functional to the build to keep training hussars in transition to 3.
Making caroleans in age2 and playing it passive caro+jaegers till you have enough ups and/or cav to push out is also an option, but I'd consider it inferior to the cav play.
Against aggressive age2 Germans (tower rush) you should still be able to hold with huss start into huss/caro+unit shipments.
India
India can be challenging because it has access to skirms in age2 which is the most notable Sweden Achille's heel. At the same time it is not a MU where you can realistically start with a stable because of the sepoy rush. So the default strat is a 10 carolean semi. Against the sepoy rush specifically it is necessary to send the 2 leather cannons as the second card in age2 and only after that the 700c to age up. Usually you have to skip 700w in order to send the 2 falcs asap and push the opponent forward Agra or India will outscale. This means you have to chop 200w for the veteran carolean upgrade which is best to do right after the 4th carolean batch, while your army is on the way to the Agra. The next best card is usually 1k coin to make Jaegers (chop another 200w for the tavern then reallocate the vills leaving only a couple on wood for future torps). Vet caroleans and jaegers is enough of a tech advantage to challenge India at this point in the game so you can be relatively aggressive on the map.
I feel like you have to constantly keep the control of the game in this MU or India will outscale. For this reason the key is to take advantage of Sweden better tempo while gradually improving your eco and army through cards in age3.
Malta
Malta has two main strategies: the German Tongue boom and the xbow/pike rush.
The first one is relatively slow so you are free to do a 5huss semi and then proceed as if you were playing a passive Brit player (expect an age2 timing or an attempt to follow your age up). Midgame revolves around making jaegers+hakkas and, if needed, hussars.
The xbow/pike rush is possibly tougher to beat because again Sweden doesn't have an easy answer against light ranged infantry ealy in the game.
The main possibilities are:
- start caroleans with 4torps and the 2 leather cannons as second card. Then keep making caro+LC with the card that gives an artillery foundry wagon and push out. Eventually consider aging or adding hussars because LC are incredibly slow and therefore not the best unit to bring around the map;
- start stable with 700w and then send 3huss as second card. Drop a rax and 3torps with the 700w and start making caro+huss. Usually send 700c and 2LC and push out.
I do not recommend to start rax, send 2LC after 4torps, then 700w and start making hussars because it is not the safest way to beat a proper bow/pike rush and it is also very passive.
Spain
In this MU hussars are not very useful in age2 and Hakkapells struggle against rods in age3. For these reasons carolean start is simply superior. Caroleans also can siege down an undefended mid map tower and/or TP. It's important to save 200w from the 700w card for veteran caroleans.
Against a very aggressive FF the main priority is to survive the initial push, while against more eco oriented play it is also important to think about balancing your combo, while keeping up with unit upgrades and eco. In both cases the first card in age3 should be 2 falconets. After that it depends on the situation. Usually 1k coin is a good follow up (switch a dozen vills to wood to quickly build a tavern) to start making jaegers. Caro+jaegers is the most intuitive 2 unit type combo. Another option is to send 1k wood, drop a foundry and start making leather cannons, then send 3 LC from the homecity. Caroleans+LC is a solid combo against Spain but the next cards have to be upgrades for your units or a skirm-rod-lancer combo will be hard to beat.
Instead of using the church tech or the jaeger card, now it makes more sense to just build a tavern from the 700w card and train Jaegers from there (4torp, 700c, 700w becomes the main build).
Key cards in age3 still are (in no specific order) 1k wood, 1k coin, 2falcs, 5hakkas, 5huss, 3mines
This guide aims to complement the strategic options of Swedes, in order to address MUs where going for carolean based play is not effective (mostly against semi FF civs that go for skirm/goon).
Specifically, it involves a stable start and the use of Jaegers and Hakkapelits.
There are many build orders that can be crafted around this strategic idea, but I'll present four of them which I believe are the most effective and efficient (also relatively simple).
All these builds work better with a TP start, which means a 16v age up. With 2 torps you can often age with 15v, but the shipment progression will be significantly worse to the point that some builds just don't work in practice.
The deck includes some cards that allow ageII play with caroleans if the opponent rushes you. 600w, 3huss, 2LC can all be replaced by eco/army upgrades if that's not a concern.
Build order reference
Basic build
|4torps | 700c | 700w | 10 jaegers | 2 falcs | 1k coin | 1k wood |
Quick timings and smooth follow up. Good eco but it depletes the first mine relatively early.
2 Falc build
|4torps | 700c | 700w | 2 falcs | 1k coin | 10jaegers | 1k wood |
2 falcs out quick, jaegers at about 12 min. Timings resemble an otto jan FF. Good eco, doesn't deplete the first mine as fast. It is the most intuitive to perform.
Church card build
|4torps | 700c | 700w | church card | 1k wood |
6 improved jaegers out fast. Not as smooth and easy to macro as the coin builds. Early eco not great but better follow up.
600c Build
|4torps | 700c | 600c | 10jaegers | 1k wood |
10 jaegers as first card in age3. Easy to macro, doesn't deplete the first mine as fast. Poor eco, safer vs age2 pressure.
Build order by age
All builds are basically identical for the first 7 minutes. The church build is slightly more efficient with torps on trees rather than on coin mines but it works either way.
Age1
3 vills shoot an animal and 3 collect the crates. Build a torp while the explorer collects treasures and goes to build the most convenient TP. Ideally find a wood treasure otherwise you have to chop 40w. Mind your macro in the first 2 TC cycles, Swedes start with only 150f so getting no idle TC is not trivial. Also when torps are built on mines, mind the berry bush spawn so it won't block the villager pathing.
The first card is 3 vills. Age up with 2 vills and 2 cows.
Transition to age2
Move all vills to chop wood while two of them also bring hunts closer to the TC. The goal is to build 2 torps and collect 200w for the stable. The 2 torps can be placed on the first mine (more efficient but they will be useless eventually) or on far mines (less efficient but will work for longer). Either way keep the second mine clear for the 4torp card. After the 2 torps are built switch 6 vills on coin. Then the rest on food when you have 200w. Keep minding the hunting work until both hunts are inside TC range.
Age2
Send 4torp wagons and build the stable with food vills. Kill the cows between torps to automatically collect the food. Use the 4 torp wagons on the 2nd mine (mind their pathing for max efficiency).
Send 700c and set the eco shipment point on a torp so that crates will be automatically collected. TC rally point is on food. If you macroed well you should be ready to click the age up button (fast age) exactly when the coin crates expire (6:50-7:00).
Transition to age3
The follow up depends on the strategy:
- for the Basic Build send 700w and use it to build torps on farther out mines. Building a market is also an option but it's not key at this point. A 2nd TP or a barracks might also be an option if you
expect pressure and can't build extra torps on distant mines. Move all vills to coin to collect 900c for the 10 Jaegers.
- for the 2 Falc build send 700w and build torps. Keep 10 vills on food and rest on coin (in this case you can spread vills on other mines to make torps gather longer). TC Rally point is on wood.
- for the church card build send 700w and build a church. Keep 10 vills on food and rest on coin with TC rally point to wood. Spare wood for the Jaeger church tech.
- for the 600c build send 600c and leave 10 vill on food while rest on coin. Again rally point is on wood.
Age3
- with the Basic build send 10jaegers as soon as you have the card and 900c. Then move about 10v on food and rest stay on coin. Rally point is on wood. Make Hakkapelits until you have enough wood to drop a rax. Usually that comes with 1k wood, since it's hard to make extra jaegers early on and dropping more torps with the chopped wood is preferable. Hakkas are also needed to defend the 2 falcs which is usually a good card to send at this point. After that 1k coin is often useful to help making more Jaegers and works as a skirm card. The cards you should focus next are cav combat, 3 mines or even the church card to switch the Jaeger macro to wood/coin. Usually you make a market and more torps with 1k wood. Later when your eco feels solid and you have a decent number of vills on wood you can drop an arsenal and get all the advanced upgrades for skirms and ranged cav. If you spare wood, work on getting TPs and stagecoach and/or a 2nd TC.
- with the 2 falc build things come quite natural. You will be making Hakkapelits while sending 2 falcs. Then 1k coin next and will use that to send 10jaegers. The 1k wood as next card will be used for infrastructure such as a rax, market+upgrades and more torps. The follow up is similar to the Basic build.
- with the Church card build you start making Hakkapelits and then move some vills on wood while sending the Church card. The goal is to get 750w for the Jaeger tech. Can also macro the other way around if you notice the church card will be ready as soon as you reach age3. After that you usually still make Hakkapelits (need about 10-12 vills on food) and send 1k wood to get extra torps+rax or 2 falcs to push. The follow up is similar to the basic build but you will have to macro all 3 resources. However mines will last longer and eventually your eco will feel more solid as a result of less idle vills wandering around the map and less idle torps.
- with the 600c build you will have easier time collecting 900c for 10 jaegers. However because of no torping in transition you won't have the card instantly ready in age3. The follow up is the same as usual but with one more card spent on a somewhat mediocre shipment which eventually results in less eco.
Some tips:
- after early age3 you don't usually need a lot of food. For the same reason steel traps is not a priority at all. On the other hand, the 2nd wood upgrade is often useful, especially after getting the jaeger church tech
- try to spread out vills on farther mines whenever possible to make torps last longer
- don't hesitate to trade food for gold at the market to complete a jaeger batch in early age3. While this is normally very unefficient, it still holds quite a strategic value so it's worth the extra resources
- keep an eye on the amount of coin each mine has. Try to deplete 2 or more at the same time when you plan to send the 3 mine card
- jaegers are already premium units. This means you dont't need unit upgrades as soon as other civs do. Instead your cards will focus on improving your eco/durability of torps. Eventually you get unit ups from the advanced arsenal and cav cards.
- since jaegers win almost any skirm battle, you usually don't need to hussar switch. Occasionally switching to hussar can be good to add some body block to your combo or simply to remacro an excess of food/shortage of coin
Suggested card order for some specific MUs:
French
French are the baseline semi FF civ against which I'd just do the standard build (4torp, 700c, 700w). Sometimes you may want to swap 700w for 700c in case of aggressive play from the opponent but I'd try to stick to 700c as second card and age up, while defending with only hussar and minutemen if possible.
In age3, I'd still wait for the 1k coin card to make jaegers from the tavern. This way you don't deplete the close mines too fast and don't hinder the production from stable which is also important in early fortress. It's also the easiest way to macro. Anything else that follows depends on the situation but should come natural.
Germans
Against a standard German uhlan semi FF, a mix of huss and hakkas + later jaegers should work well and possibly better than hakkas+jaegers in early age3. The card order after the standard age2 agenda should be something like 5hakkas, 5huss, 1k coin, etc. with focus on cav up cards. When starting huss vs Germans it is important to mind vill protection and the use of minutemen since Germans outmass your cav with uhlans. It is also important for the same reason and because it is functional to the build to keep training hussars in transition to 3.
Making caroleans in age2 and playing it passive caro+jaegers till you have enough ups and/or cav to push out is also an option, but I'd consider it inferior to the cav play.
Against aggressive age2 Germans (tower rush) you should still be able to hold with huss start into huss/caro+unit shipments.
India
India can be challenging because it has access to skirms in age2 which is the most notable Sweden Achille's heel. At the same time it is not a MU where you can realistically start with a stable because of the sepoy rush. So the default strat is a 10 carolean semi. Against the sepoy rush specifically it is necessary to send the 2 leather cannons as the second card in age2 and only after that the 700c to age up. Usually you have to skip 700w in order to send the 2 falcs asap and push the opponent forward Agra or India will outscale. This means you have to chop 200w for the veteran carolean upgrade which is best to do right after the 4th carolean batch, while your army is on the way to the Agra. The next best card is usually 1k coin to make Jaegers (chop another 200w for the tavern then reallocate the vills leaving only a couple on wood for future torps). Vet caroleans and jaegers is enough of a tech advantage to challenge India at this point in the game so you can be relatively aggressive on the map.
I feel like you have to constantly keep the control of the game in this MU or India will outscale. For this reason the key is to take advantage of Sweden better tempo while gradually improving your eco and army through cards in age3.
Malta
Malta has two main strategies: the German Tongue boom and the xbow/pike rush.
The first one is relatively slow so you are free to do a 5huss semi and then proceed as if you were playing a passive Brit player (expect an age2 timing or an attempt to follow your age up). Midgame revolves around making jaegers+hakkas and, if needed, hussars.
The xbow/pike rush is possibly tougher to beat because again Sweden doesn't have an easy answer against light ranged infantry ealy in the game.
The main possibilities are:
- start caroleans with 4torps and the 2 leather cannons as second card. Then keep making caro+LC with the card that gives an artillery foundry wagon and push out. Eventually consider aging or adding hussars because LC are incredibly slow and therefore not the best unit to bring around the map;
- start stable with 700w and then send 3huss as second card. Drop a rax and 3torps with the 700w and start making caro+huss. Usually send 700c and 2LC and push out.
I do not recommend to start rax, send 2LC after 4torps, then 700w and start making hussars because it is not the safest way to beat a proper bow/pike rush and it is also very passive.
Spain
In this MU hussars are not very useful in age2 and Hakkapells struggle against rods in age3. For these reasons carolean start is simply superior. Caroleans also can siege down an undefended mid map tower and/or TP. It's important to save 200w from the 700w card for veteran caroleans.
Against a very aggressive FF the main priority is to survive the initial push, while against more eco oriented play it is also important to think about balancing your combo, while keeping up with unit upgrades and eco. In both cases the first card in age3 should be 2 falconets. After that it depends on the situation. Usually 1k coin is a good follow up (switch a dozen vills to wood to quickly build a tavern) to start making jaegers. Caro+jaegers is the most intuitive 2 unit type combo. Another option is to send 1k wood, drop a foundry and start making leather cannons, then send 3 LC from the homecity. Caroleans+LC is a solid combo against Spain but the next cards have to be upgrades for your units or a skirm-rod-lancer combo will be hard to beat.
Re: Sweden Jaeger semi FF
Added a note to aknowledge the fact that Sweden always have Jaegers and Black riders at the tavern.
Also added additional details on some MUs, and maybe will add more in the future.
Also added additional details on some MUs, and maybe will add more in the future.
Re: Sweden Jaeger semi FF
Just a game to showcase the strat
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- [SP] LazarosVas[FR] vs Garjabaldi[SW] - Courland.age3yrec
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Courland
Re: Sweden Jaeger semi FF
But isn't church card the base of jaeger build? 80 wood/gold jaeger worth a build designed around this, while FF with one tavern and 200 gold jaeger just doesn't make sense.
Re: Sweden Jaeger semi FF
Well yes, there is less power advantage compared to a build with the church tech. But still, this simple build has tempo plus decent eco and units. Unlike other civs, Sweden has torps on the map autogathering coin as well as 3+2 mines from cards to replace them. Also Sweden has free access to advanced arsenal so you can eventually upgrade jaegers, while other civs usually upgrade their units from combat cards and struggle to send AA (or just don't have it in deck). Of course other civs also don't always have jaegers at the tavern.
Basically, going for jaegers is both a solution to the fact that you don't have skirms and an advantage because of the civ features. The semi FF is just a natural consequences of these things. Of course when you can't age you don't and just play age2.
You can always send the church card later in the game if you want. Afterall it's also a 5% HP upgrade on top of the cost change.
Basically, going for jaegers is both a solution to the fact that you don't have skirms and an advantage because of the civ features. The semi FF is just a natural consequences of these things. Of course when you can't age you don't and just play age2.
You can always send the church card later in the game if you want. Afterall it's also a 5% HP upgrade on top of the cost change.
Re: Sweden Jaeger semi FF
With Jäger being available by default they do in fact have a skirm, just not in the standard way. Going for the church tech will still be the best option on most maps since 80 80 eats through mines way slower than 200Garja wrote: ↑23 Jan 2024, 15:10Well yes, there is less power advantage compared to a build with the church tech. But still, this simple build has tempo plus decent eco and units. Unlike other civs, Sweden has torps on the map autogathering coin as well as 3+2 mines from cards to replace them. Also Sweden has free access to advanced arsenal so you can eventually upgrade jaegers, while other civs usually upgrade their units from combat cards and struggle to send AA (or just don't have it in deck). Of course other civs also don't always have jaegers at the tavern.
Basically, going for jaegers is both a solution to the fact that you don't have skirms and an advantage because of the civ features. The semi FF is just a natural consequences of these things. Of course when you can't age you don't and just play age2.
You can always send the church card later in the game if you want. Afterall it's also a 5% HP upgrade on top of the cost change.
Re: Sweden Jaeger semi FF
This build is completely outdated anyway. Check the correct build and other strats among this collection of recs https://mega.nz/folder/XkJFgYRQ#8tlN9xrS34igA3ux-QXsPw
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