Cav defense formation

[helln00]

So I was watching a video from T-west about how box formation is used in aoe 2 and it sounds very useful.



Aoe 3 has a similar formation, the defense formation. Does anyone think using this trick helps in aoe 3?

since armies can get big pretty fast it may not be useful age 3 forward but in like age 2 cav starts I can see this being good

[EAGLEMUT]

I think yes actually, hand cav defend mode is secretly OP and it's a matter of time before high level players figure it out.
It's not even the formation position that is the major difference, but the fact that it grants speedboost on hit. That can easily mean the difference between killing a vill or not killing a vill. Or maintaining a snare of course, as is the main point of it.
I should get ahead of the game and start using it tbh, problem is APM

[Jerimuno]

A speed boost? Someone's gotta make a short video on that in aoe3

[helln00]

I think yes actually, hand cav defend mode is secretly OP and it's a matter of time before high level players figure it out.
It's not even the formation position that is the major difference, but the fact that it grants speedboost on hit. That can easily mean the difference between killing a vill or not killing a vill. Or maintaining a snare of course, as is the main point of it.
I should get ahead of the game and start using it tbh, problem is APM

Speedboost? is that the one that occurs when melee units hit another one? I thought that occurs on all formations?

I love using this as china with the 7 steppe shipment, they have small hitboxes so they pack tightly and path through buildings easily, also makes it easier for all 7 to hit a vil on the first hit

[I_HaRRiiSoN_I]

I think yes actually, hand cav defend mode is secretly OP and it's a matter of time before high level players figure it out.
It's not even the formation position that is the major difference, but the fact that it grants speedboost on hit. That can easily mean the difference between killing a vill or not killing a vill. Or maintaining a snare of course, as is the main point of it.
I should get ahead of the game and start using it tbh, problem is APM

Not to mention the speed changes during re-formation between transitioning between line and column formation of 5 huss. Eagle god doing gods work again.

But yeah this legit looks incredibly strong

[EAGLEMUT]

I think yes actually, hand cav defend mode is secretly OP and it's a matter of time before high level players figure it out.
It's not even the formation position that is the major difference, but the fact that it grants speedboost on hit. That can easily mean the difference between killing a vill or not killing a vill. Or maintaining a snare of course, as is the main point of it.
I should get ahead of the game and start using it tbh, problem is APM

Speedboost? is that the one that occurs when melee units hit another one?

Yeah.

I thought that occurs on all formations?

It does for hand Infantry. Not for hand Cavalry.

[helln00]

I think yes actually, hand cav defend mode is secretly OP and it's a matter of time before high level players figure it out.
It's not even the formation position that is the major difference, but the fact that it grants speedboost on hit. That can easily mean the difference between killing a vill or not killing a vill. Or maintaining a snare of course, as is the main point of it.
I should get ahead of the game and start using it tbh, problem is APM

Speedboost? is that the one that occurs when melee units hit another one?

Yeah.

I thought that occurs on all formations?

It does for hand Infantry. Not for hand Cavalry.

Oh did not know that, that sounds pretty good, I am imaging 5 cav battles all in defend mode from now on lol

[helln00]

There is an annoying bug with defend mode in DE though, the units seems to freeze when switching to it and it takes a bit of clicking to get them moving again

[Garja]

I already use it for raiding, just more dps per volley as units are all packed together. Shouldnt reveal this stuff tho

[Kaiserklein]

I wouldn't change formations just because then your cav won't ever be able to move in "column" formation again (it's a weird bug) which is probably just more valuable than the speed boost thing

[Garja]

I actually remove the column thing on purpose from every batch of cav as it's just better to have them in line (e.g. when running away from more cav).

[Kaiserklein]

What's better is being able to switch between line and column formations. You don't have to "remove" it, you can just control your cav so that it doesn't move as a column.
And whenever you want to get a speed boost, or just to have that column shape, you switch back to column mode.

[Garja]

I'ts better until you misclick and they get snared

[Kaiserklein]

Which is why you baby sit your cav and don't missclick and end up having superior unit control

[Garja]

I prefer to setup them in line in advance so I can right click minimap and go macro in base while other guy babysits to snare and tunnel vision himself. Or atleast to balance out the fact he can just z move and go afk while I would have to babysit. Talking about retreat. Wouldn't advise minimap to go in.

[SoldieR]

I remember hearing this defend mode thing but never took time to test

[rsy]

Shouldnt reveal this stuff tho

sweaty ass try hard nerd

[aaryngend]

What's better is being able to switch between line and column formations. You don't have to "remove" it, you can just control your cav so that it doesn't move as a column.
And whenever you want to get a speed boost, or just to have that column shape, you switch back to column mode.

But can we switch between those modes without any hiccup or a softlock, even when in combat? This stuff sounds OP and I expect a removal of this feature soon.

[Kaiserklein]

I don't think you got what I meant. That "mode" is not a stance you choose, it's just the way unit formations work. E.g if you click 5 huss far away on the map, they'll move as a column (behind each other). While if they're moving a few tiles away they'll stay in a line shaped formation (next to each other).
And when they switch to column, the huss that will be on the front of that column have to speed up for a couple seconds to get in that position swiftly. So the trick if you want to be able to catch up with your opponent while both forming lines is to switch to column by clicking far behind his army, so that some of your huss speed up to the front and thus are able to snare his units.

And so for some weird reason, if you ever switch the stance of a group of units, they'll lose this ability to switch to columns. It's also true for e.g musks that you meleed or skirms you staggered, but it's not that big of a deal for infantry. But for hand cav it's really annoying.

[harcha]

This stuff sounds OP and I expect a removal of this feature soon.

as kaiser describes, it's a feature and is intended. it's not getting removed

But can we switch between those modes without any hiccup or a softlock, even when in combat?

this i am wondering myself. it seemed like after they fixed units getting frozen the stances in DE actually worked better than in RE. can you change a stance of unit while it's walking so that it doesn't stop? has someone checked?

[Kaiserklein]

Yes you can now switch stance while walking and there will only be a slight hiccup, instead of the unit stopping altogether like on legacy.
Again though this doesn't apply to what I described as it's not a change of stance, but just a change of formation, similarly to how pull tricking works.

[aaryngend]

I don't think you got what I meant. That "mode" is not a stance you choose, it's just the way unit formations work. E.g if you click 5 huss far away on the map, they'll move as a column (behind each other). While if they're moving a few tiles away they'll stay in a line shaped formation (next to each other).

Ah that one. It's weird that I knew about it for many years, but I never put 1 and 1 together to use it to my advantage (clicking further away so they walk in a line instead of moving in a cone-shaped horizontal line).
Using the minimap should be faster in this case, you can click far away without moving your mouse much, you just need good accuracy so they don't walk in the wrong direction.

I used to do this with abus guns, attack moving very closely in front of them so they form a cone and attack all at once.

Now the only question left is how defend stance behaves and what little quirks it brings to the table, mostly concerning the speed boost.

[Squamiger]

this thread seems full of high level secrets, i love it

also watching that video makes me wish aoe3 had flank formation. imagine dodging a heavy cannon volley by splitting your skirms into two groups!

[helln00]

This stuff sounds OP and I expect a removal of this feature soon.

as kaiser describes, it's a feature and is intended. it's not getting removed

But can we switch between those modes without any hiccup or a softlock, even when in combat?

this i am wondering myself. it seemed like after they fixed units getting frozen the stances in DE actually worked better than in RE. can you change a stance of unit while it's walking so that it doesn't stop? has someone checked?

units do freeze when switching to defense formation still, which is a bit annoying in applying the box cav