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Plantinator wrote:Well lets be honest shrines seemed a lot better when torps werent around

Plantinator wrote:I actually really like the concept of torps but it might still be to strong. Maybe nerf torp build limit?

n0el wrote:So you can only get 80 pop in age 2? Torps are fine now honestly, the only issue with sweden is they basically rely entirely on getting to age 4 and getting svea lifeguard which is insane

bremhoek wrote: Against Dutch i won like all my matches with this build, i like it much against them (go yumi nagi or yumi yabasume).

kevthegooner wrote:I have played this build order several times now, and here is what I like about it: flexibility and unpredictability. I have found too many Japan BOs to be easy to counter. Shrine boom? Build pikes. Ashi spam? Spam anti-infantry. I know that a lot of that is due to my limited abilities (~1100 ELO) but I often felt sort of "locked" in with other BOs.

This BO also offers some unpredictability. Opening with Nagis then switching to yumi/yabu feels like great tempo.

Thanks Dansil! Keep those wacky BOs coming!

onfiregun17 wrote:Too lazy to do math but you're much better off doing a kami shrine boom for eco. Like why send GFA as your first card and then not use your consulate techs until 8+ minutes?

onfiregun17 wrote:Too lazy to do math but you're much better off doing a kami shrine boom for eco. Like why send GFA as your first card and then not use your consulate techs until 8+ minutes?

hastina wrote:Why not have it all? A faster age up, A shrine boom, Early bank, church and all Spanish tech? I out boomed and out massed all my opponents with GFA + Toshugu by doing the following
2 shrines with starting wood, with a juicy wood treasure, a third shrine. Helps in aging up faster as you have 2-3 shrines instead of just 1.
Japan can't have all ,going cons boom ,eco boom and also having units?? also you have to choose either 1

card 1 - Good Faith Agreements
What is the point of early bank if you use the GFA on an economic unit?? unless you are playing a NR 10 ,you have to spend the export on useful techs/units.

Age up with 4 vills, Except for 6 vills on Food, rest on wood and shrines on wood. Build a consulate with 200w during transition to age 2.
card 2 - Send 4 shrine wagons (600w value, gets built without monk idle time who can get more treasures)

Japan age up time is slow and assuming you age around 4:30-5:00 mins most of the treasures is gone anyways ,you have to consider the walking time of the wagon while monks are just better which can be used to place shrine wherever around the map instantly and deny enemy hunts

Build a barrack, a stable, a market - get each market tech one by one, Q Yumi and Nagi and finish batches as you get resources.
This is will be too late since you have to chop it ,becomes too costly ,600w is better

card 3 - Send 4 shrine wagons a second time (600w value)

Kami+Ports cons makes shrine cost 75w so 4 shrine wagons it not actually worth 600w ,it's (4x75)300w which is pretty trash ,this is the reason why no one uses this card ,which makes 600w a lot better & flexible option.

card 4 - 300 export as 4th card, send Church and switch to Spain to finish Nanban trade (crates contain 25% more res) and merchant marine (shipments come fast)
stay on Spanish consulate for XP trickle.
Again a shipment used for making crates worth 25% more it's not worth it at this point it could easily been a 600w/4v with std build
card 5 - 600 wood (but 750 as Nanban trade is already done) Finish rest of the shrines. Switch card 5 with 6 if age up is a priority.
5th card would be an easy 600g here and now you are sending this to invest on your infrastucutre
card 6 - 600 coin (but 750 now) AGE UP or more units. Mix in Ashigaru, Shrines on food. If you a lot of Yumi massed already.
card 7 - 600 wood (but 750 now) more yumi
card 8 - cherry orchards
card 9 - 600 coin (but 750 now) doesn't matter if you age or not as you have a mass, would have won all fights in age 2 and have resources left over as the boom is in full swing but age up if opponent ages up.
card 10 - Heavenly kami as you have all the shrines now, better get more trickle from them.
Shogunate for XP + daimyo and cheaper units
In age 3, bullionism for 1-2 more shipments and switch to Japanese consulate for passive attack boost and units.
Shrine on coin to get merchantilsim from Church for more shipments. Send unit upgrade cards are more units.

dansil92 wrote:

onfiregun17 wrote:Too lazy to do math but you're much better off doing a kami shrine boom for eco. Like why send GFA as your first card and then not use your consulate techs until 8+ minutes?

you're replying to the above post and not the original post, I assume?

harcha wrote:@hastina did you assume shrines cost 150w?

hastina wrote:

harcha wrote:@hastina did you assume shrines cost 150w?

My bad, but I made this.

gibson wrote:Don't 600g 600g lol.