Healin' Uniths

Rainbow Land callentournies
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Healin' Uniths

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Post by callentournies »

So since I started playing otto and in an attempt to not become a 3x worse RTS player by playing the easiest civ in the game and because you already have a church built in every game and because imams only cost 115 (let's goooah!) food and since I always Deli start no matter what I've started pulling back low hp Delis to be healed up so I don't die of boredom in-game.

This is really only reasonable if you cav semi and opponent doesn't make units, so youre just idling under a naked TC and only taking TC fire dmg. So maybe this isn't very applicable. Anything else and I think it's too hard to spend micro and apm on it, or at another point in the game. Outliers are high hp units like mams or smth. Anyways this does a few things:

1) Idles for "free" since you don't lose units or lose hp on your units. If losing cav under enemy tc for idle time is already considered worth, why not pull them back and heal them to make it triply worth
2) A few cav will be rehealed after youve decided to stop making cav and age. Normally these cav are too low hp to do much (or theyre dead and can't do anything), but you can go in a 2nd time and force more idle time or force a port TC in a bad place or force opp to make units or etc.
3) have a bunch of full hp cav to vet on age 3


clip showin some healing: https://clips.twitch.tv/DifferentViscou ... vpr2kfTpK6
game from POV: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1803478591
game from rec & commentary (6:00 for raiding and pull back):


If you heal one 99-hp Deli (conservative hp, it can tank another tc shot and go to 27 hp), it nets you 138 res. Let's call it 140 for the numbers' sake.

5 healed delis = 700 res - 115 = 585 net res
7 healed delis = 980 res - 115 = 865 net res
9 healed delis = 1260 res - 115 = 1145 net res
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No Flag uberjz
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Re: Healin' Uniths

Post by uberjz »

investigating the potential of healing units is a great excuse to toxically ego-rec "we aren't the champions"

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Canada Mitoe
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Re: Healin' Uniths

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Post by Mitoe »

Time to start opening with a church instead of a TP with Germany and heal my uhlans
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Italy Garja
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Re: Healin' Uniths

Post by Garja »

Worth it if those unit will be used and if you spare the APM to the process. Easier with Otto.
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Re: Healin' Uniths

Post by dansil92 »

As a recently converted Griot Enjoyer™ I can confirm that healing units in early game can bring some immense value. Unfortunately, as Garja says, otto frees up tons of apm and hausa is an apm sinkhole. At least the griots are stupidly good in fights as well as between fights for healing/ making vills train faster [because hausa makes sense]
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Great Britain andrewgs
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Re: Healin' Uniths

Post by andrewgs »

callentournies wrote: ↑
25 Apr 2023, 21:50
1) Idles for "free" since you don't lose units or lose hp on your units. If losing cav under enemy tc for idle time is already considered worth, why not pull them back and heal them to make it triply worth
2) A few cav will be rehealed after youve decided to stop making cav and age. Normally these cav are too low hp to do much (or theyre dead and can't do anything), but you can go in a 2nd time and force more idle time or force a port TC in a bad place or force opp to make units or etc.
1) Losing cav under tc is not worthwhile.
1 deli = 281 vs at base gather rates. Each tc fire shot with 10v costs 30vs. It takes 5 hits to kill a deli so 150vs.
Most damage from raiding comes from vils being moved or hunts wandering. You're also depleting your own res while the opponent isn't.

2) If you've just been causing vils to garison and running cav back you dont lose so much hp and end up with a few at mid hp, which is enough to deny fwd tc or raid during fights.
callentournies wrote: ↑
25 Apr 2023, 21:50
If you heal one 99-hp Deli (conservative hp, it can tank another tc shot and go to 27 hp), it nets you 138 res. Let's call it 140 for the numbers' sake.

5 healed delis = 700 res - 115 = 585 net res
7 healed delis = 980 res - 115 = 865 net res
9 healed delis = 1260 res - 115 = 1145 net res
this is comparing to letting them die or saying low hp ones have no value. I'd look at it like this

5 delis = 1405vs to train = 150vs (5x3 tc hits) to 200vs (5x4 tc hits) worth of damage when pulling back

Uhlan die in one less hit (4hits) so its more difficult. Mexico get a priest for free, but chianco have less hp than hus so also die in 4 hits, and almost everyone makes units vs mexico. Iro gets a healer on age up too....

I haven't seen anyone proxy the stable with otto to get cav under tc sooner and not be scouted.
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Re: Healin' Uniths

Post by callentournies »

andrewgs wrote: ↑
26 Apr 2023, 02:55
I haven't seen anyone proxy the stable with otto to get cav under tc sooner and not be scouted.
watch me stream

the rest of your post im not convinced. idle time villager seconds lost is impacted by redistribution and walking after, and it delays builds. that's THE biggest part of it -- tempo disruptor. that's strategy games innit, you make concessions such that your opponent has to make bigger concessions, unless you play TR.

having full hp cav is better than having low hp or no cav. that'sh my beeg argument.
If I were a petal
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Great Britain andrewgs
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Re: Healin' Uniths

Post by andrewgs »

yes that's my point, you're going under tc, conq puts vils in tc, and you stay under tc until all 5 units are low hp for healing.

I'm saying you go under tc, pull back as soon as you notice he's put several vils in tc (after pulling back 1-2 cav), then you can come back with 3-4 and repeat. This way you get the redistribution and walking time twice
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Re: Healin' Uniths

Post by Kaiserklein »

Works with malta when sieging a building barely in TC fire range, you can micro units back after they got shot once and heal them between your raxes. Works better with cover mode micro for pikes too. But it's much harder and situational than with cav and doesn't net you as many res
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Korea South Miyawaki Sakura
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Re: Healin' Uniths

Post by Miyawaki Sakura »

How about cover mode shotel+Abun or Coyote+wp?
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United States of America minimoult21
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Re: Healin' Uniths

Post by minimoult21 »

when rattan shields use to be on maps, it was a common strat by some players. Run in with rattans then put in cover mode, and get a church to heal them up.
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