No Flag shaun
Crossbow
Posts: 18

09 Feb 2021, 03:02

I played Germany against Inca and lost. I felt I could've won but I really didn't know what to do. He just making elite chimu runners and nothing seemed to stop them. Can I please get some feedback?
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India Challenger_Marco
Jaeger
Posts: 2133
ESO: challenger_marco

09 Feb 2021, 04:21

Just make some Doppelsoldners they have multi vs shock inf no way he breaks that and kills your army.
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No Flag Squamiger
Howdah
Posts: 1007
ESO: Squamiger

09 Feb 2021, 05:23

Yea watch the haitch vs Kevin game that just happened but make dopps instead of ww I think
We renounce everything except victory.
France Kaiserklein
Pro Player
Posts: 9507
Location: Paris
GameRanger ID: 5529322

09 Feb 2021, 11:35

Dops suck ass vs jungle bows, and they're not mobile. Then again WWs also suck ass so...

The way to win this MU is to stay on top of everything. They'll just keep raiding with a unit you can't catch so you have to react quickly, drop towers or TCs, maybe wall up. Contain them, tech stagecoach, get petards or falcs if they turtle too hard. Don't let them grab any map, don't let them TC boom hard, don't let them mass an army. Mass your own unkillable army and pressure constantly.

But yeah, assuming they go for this kind of lame (full turtle and raids), I really don't have better advice to give than "outplay that lowbob"
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[Armag] diarouga wrote:Playing Aztec is a 10% handicap
LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
No Flag shaun
Crossbow
Posts: 18

09 Feb 2021, 12:27

Thanks guys especially @Kaiserklein I was starting to win a couple of good games with Germany and after I lost to this, even thought I thought I had a good chance of winning, I got a huge drop in confidence. It seems that this seems to a be one off (lame) kind of strat that everybody would encounter at times. If I understand correctly, I need to play for the long game, wall up, eco up, and defend like crazy and maybe attack in age 4 with a full variety of army.
No Flag shaun
Crossbow
Posts: 18

09 Feb 2021, 12:30

Challenger_Marco wrote:Just make some Doppelsoldners they have multi vs shock inf no way he breaks that and kills your army.


While that makes sense in the face of it, I read that Chimus don't snare and dont get snared. They are also incredibly fast and dopps are slow. So, how would my dopps even catch them? All they can do is maybe score 5-8 off them away.
No Flag helln00
Lancer
Posts: 764
ESO: helln00

09 Feb 2021, 12:34

I dont think you want to use dopps to chase them, u use dopps to defend skirms and range units and chase chimmus away while you move towards their base with your own foward base.
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San Marino jesus3
Jaeger
Posts: 2046

09 Feb 2021, 12:41

From my recent experience (as Inca), the games rarely ever go past age 2 for Inca and age 3 for Germany, they play out in Germany's early fortress. If they manage to defend the first and second wave of Inca spam through good positioning and micro while preserving a decent macro, they beat Inca. If they get caught off-guard or get pushed off resources for good, Germany just lost right there (see Haitch vs Kevin).

As Kaiser already pointed out, everything has to go according to plan for Germany - they have to play very precise and on top of their game.
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No Flag Astaroth
Lancer
Posts: 836

09 Feb 2021, 12:51

I have no idea, but could perhaps even falc+dopp+skirm work? Especially if he stays age2. Or do falcs die too quickly?
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Latvia harcha
Jaeger
Posts: 2973
ESO: hatamoto_samurai

09 Feb 2021, 12:52

I doubt falcs die too quickly if you can cover them with dops, but that does sound like an insanely coin heavy combo, and it's also very immobile.
princeofcarthage wrote:remember Prince warned about it years ago
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India Challenger_Marco
Jaeger
Posts: 2133
ESO: challenger_marco

09 Feb 2021, 13:07

shaun wrote:
Challenger_Marco wrote:Just make some Doppelsoldners they have multi vs shock inf no way he breaks that and kills your army.


While that makes sense in the face of it, I read that Chimus don't snare and dont get snared. They are also incredibly fast and dopps are slow. So, how would my dopps even catch them? All they can do is maybe score 5-8 off them away.

It's not for chasing obviously if he attacks you use dopps into them else keep ur dopps back and skrims forward.
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Tuvalu gibson
Ninja
Posts: 12181
Location: USA

09 Feb 2021, 13:47

Dopps are good vs inca btw
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No Flag Squamiger
Howdah
Posts: 1007
ESO: Squamiger

09 Feb 2021, 17:49

Does Germany struggle bc it’s a FF civ without falcs?
We renounce everything except victory.
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Italy Garja
ESOC Maps Team
Donator 02
Posts: 8838
ESO: Garja

09 Feb 2021, 19:45

Does Ger struggle? Just don't make WWs, such an akward unit vs Inca composition.
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Germany Lukas_L99
Pro Player
Donator 01
Posts: 1939
ESO: Lukas_L99
Location: Frankfurt

09 Feb 2021, 19:46

I'd also think dopps should be much better vs inca's 3 unit composition. Sure they get sniped quite easily but jungle bowmen only have 1.25 vs heavy inf, that's nice i guess. Also the area dmg should do well vs the mass inca usually gets.
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Vietnam SquidTheSid
Musketeer
Posts: 72
Location: Duber

10 Feb 2021, 01:17

Lukas_L99 wrote:I'd also think dopps should be much better vs inca's 3 unit composition. Sure they get sniped quite easily but jungle bowmen only have 1.25 vs heavy inf, that's nice i guess. Also the area dmg should do well vs the mass inca usually gets.

JB have 1.75x HI. They also have less HP than Crossbowmen.
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Tuvalu gibson
Ninja
Posts: 12181
Location: USA

10 Feb 2021, 02:19

Dop skirm uhlan is the combo vs Inca
France Kaiserklein
Pro Player
Posts: 9507
Location: Paris
GameRanger ID: 5529322

10 Feb 2021, 09:35

I wanna see someone win with dops vs an inca player with good micro. I'm pretty sure it's trash.
Or maybe together with falcs it's fine, but that's about it. And falc dop is expensive and slow to setup.

Just get BR whenever you can, it's way better.
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[Armag] diarouga wrote:Playing Aztec is a 10% handicap
LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
France Le Hussard sur le toit
Lancer
Posts: 906
ESO: LeHussardsurletoit

10 Feb 2021, 10:33

Next MU of the month ? @PancakePrincess
diarouga : "Which is more important, strategy or mechanics? Build orders, or cute hussar micro ?"
Hazza : "Don't know but my hussar micro is sexy as fuck."
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Tuvalu gibson
Ninja
Posts: 12181
Location: USA

10 Feb 2021, 12:21

Yea 9 br gonna save you when 60 chimu/pike z move your skirms
France Kaiserklein
Pro Player
Posts: 9507
Location: Paris
GameRanger ID: 5529322

10 Feb 2021, 13:49

You're supposed to trade with bow/pike in colo already to force them into making more jungle bows and prevent them from just right clicking you when you age (bows sitting in chokes). Then you have vet bows which deal good damage to everything, some leftover pikes to block, your vet uhlans, and yes you get 9 BR because they're great at kiting (kiting works even better since chimus don't snare) and they overkill a bit less than WWs / block better than them vs melee units if you have to resort to that. Also nice macro wise because you should have some safe gold left after going bow/pike in colo. And BR are great at catching raids, unlike any other German unit.

On the other hand dops don't get to connect because all inca units are faster, get sniped by jungle bows, and actually get blocked decently by inca pikes. Not to mention you need to tech them to veteran, and cut some batches of skirms to get batches of dops. And generally speaking you need a lot of mass to smash your shit in this kind of melee fights, obviously here inca will just outmass and overrun the dops with a bit of micro, which is why kiting away is a superior way to get good trades.
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[Armag] diarouga wrote:Playing Aztec is a 10% handicap
LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..

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