The problem with walls

User avatar
Netherlands edeholland
ESOC Community Team
Donator 01
Posts: 5033
Joined: Feb 11, 2015
ESO: edeholland
GameRanger ID: 4053888
Clan: ESOC

Re: The problem with walls

Post by edeholland »

Why not in colonial. Fuck it, might make for some interesting strategy.
France Kaiserklein
Pro Player
Posts: 10278
Joined: Jun 6, 2015
Location: Paris
GameRanger ID: 5529322

Re: The problem with walls

Post by Kaiserklein »

Cause bastion is moved to fortress so people can't really go super turtle in colonial. Imo trade monopoly should be a potential answer to bastion, so at the same age.
Image
Image
Image
LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
User avatar
Canada Mitoe
Advanced Theory Craftsman
Posts: 5486
Joined: Aug 23, 2015
ESO: Mitoe
GameRanger ID: 346407

Re: The problem with walls

Post by Mitoe »

Earlier than industrial sounds awful to me.
France Kaiserklein
Pro Player
Posts: 10278
Joined: Jun 6, 2015
Location: Paris
GameRanger ID: 5529322

Re: The problem with walls

Post by Kaiserklein »

Why though
Image
Image
Image
LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
User avatar
Tuvalu gibson
Ninja
ECL Reigning Champs
Posts: 13597
Joined: May 4, 2015
Location: USA

Re: The problem with walls

Post by gibson »

its such an irrelevant mechanic who cares either way honestly.
France Kaiserklein
Pro Player
Posts: 10278
Joined: Jun 6, 2015
Location: Paris
GameRanger ID: 5529322

Re: The problem with walls

Post by Kaiserklein »

Well on some maps it's relevant. It all depends on the position of the tps
If you can wall up to defend the tp line while the other guy is camping, he's gonna have a hard time contesting them
Image
Image
Image
LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
User avatar
Turkey HUMMAN
Lancer
Posts: 817
Joined: Apr 16, 2017
ESO: HUMMAN

Re: The problem with walls

Post by HUMMAN »

A big part of game is taking resources on the map(hunts, mines ) i dont get why tp's shouldn't be like that, since they are not generally in-base rather away from base to be contested. This perspective of mine also supports the idea natives should be an advantage to owner since you also pay to take the map control, and natives are limited. Discussing is going else where but i wonder what top players would think if natives had no pop limit in sup. (I personally think it wouldnt matter that much, which supports that they are not premium units buff nats zoi)
Image
Netherlands momuuu
Ninja
Posts: 14237
Joined: Jun 7, 2015
ESO: Jerom_

Re: The problem with walls

Post by momuuu »

Aoe3 is a game designed with relatively few strategic elements. There's shipments which are somewhat one dimensional, and there is the part where you generally have to control natural resources. If you remove the need to control natural resources or remove the punishment for not doing so, then the game doesn't really have much left that's fun. Walls push the game into lategame, and I can't name a single mechanic of aoe3 in the lategame that makes it interesting.

Walls are too cheap for what they do. They should be more expensive, so that actually walling up the entire map costs more than a handful of units. Trade monopoly/Build time/hitpoints aren't actually getting to the core of the problem, which is that walls are simply too cheap.
User avatar
United States of America SoldieR
Pro Player
Posts: 2270
Joined: Feb 22, 2015
ESO: SoldieR
Location: Chi City

Re: The problem with walls

Post by SoldieR »

Ready?..

Like in AOM...

Make walls cost coin
User avatar
Italy Garja
Retired Contributor
Donator 02
Posts: 9729
Joined: Feb 11, 2015
ESO: Garja

Re: The problem with walls

Post by Garja »

Trade monopoly is not exactly the answer to bastion but more like to excessive campy style, including wall spam. And no, it's not a irrelevant mechanic. It was prob devs attempt to counterbalance the abusability of certain game features like walls or water. I think before industrial there isn't really a problem with campy playstyle.
Image Image Image
Netherlands momuuu
Ninja
Posts: 14237
Joined: Jun 7, 2015
ESO: Jerom_

Re: The problem with walls

Post by momuuu »

I think the main usage of trade monopoly is to counter people hiding on the map. It's really nice to know that at best your opponent will delay the game for 5 minutes.
User avatar
Norway spanky4ever
Gendarme
iwillspankyou
Posts: 8389
Joined: Apr 13, 2015

Re: The problem with walls

  • Quote

Post by spanky4ever »

I like the Jerom wall, cos its strategic and make sense. I do not like 3 layers of walls, - and I certainly don't like 7000hp walls, like Aztec can achieve in the later game. At that point it's not about who has the map or who made the best units, its only about who has the most unbreakable walls
Hippocrits are the worst of animals. I love elifants.
User avatar
Tuvalu gibson
Ninja
ECL Reigning Champs
Posts: 13597
Joined: May 4, 2015
Location: USA

Re: The problem with walls

Post by gibson »

Garja wrote:Trade monopoly is not exactly the answer to bastion but more like to excessive campy style, including wall spam. And no, it's not a irrelevant mechanic. It was prob devs attempt to counterbalance the abusability of certain game features like walls or water. I think before industrial there isn't really a problem with campy playstyle.
It happens in less than 1 percent of games, can't be used in qs = irrelevant.
France Kaiserklein
Pro Player
Posts: 10278
Joined: Jun 6, 2015
Location: Paris
GameRanger ID: 5529322

Re: The problem with walls

Post by Kaiserklein »

QS is in itself irrelevant
Image
Image
Image
LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
User avatar
Italy Garja
Retired Contributor
Donator 02
Posts: 9729
Joined: Feb 11, 2015
ESO: Garja

Re: The problem with walls

Post by Garja »

gibson wrote:
Garja wrote:Trade monopoly is not exactly the answer to bastion but more like to excessive campy style, including wall spam. And no, it's not a irrelevant mechanic. It was prob devs attempt to counterbalance the abusability of certain game features like walls or water. I think before industrial there isn't really a problem with campy playstyle.
It happens in less than 1 percent of games, can't be used in qs = irrelevant.

it happens in 1% cause people have 80 iq
Image Image Image
User avatar
Tuvalu gibson
Ninja
ECL Reigning Champs
Posts: 13597
Joined: May 4, 2015
Location: USA

Re: The problem with walls

Post by gibson »

Garja wrote:
gibson wrote:
Garja wrote:Trade monopoly is not exactly the answer to bastion but more like to excessive campy style, including wall spam. And no, it's not a irrelevant mechanic. It was prob devs attempt to counterbalance the abusability of certain game features like walls or water. I think before industrial there isn't really a problem with campy playstyle.
It happens in less than 1 percent of games, can't be used in qs = irrelevant.

it happens in 1% cause people have 80 iq
No its irrelevant because its impractical in 99 percent of games.
User avatar
Italy Garja
Retired Contributor
Donator 02
Posts: 9729
Joined: Feb 11, 2015
ESO: Garja

Re: The problem with walls

Post by Garja »

It is very practical if you have complete control but you can't end the game. Exactly the case vs wall laming.
Image Image Image
France Kaiserklein
Pro Player
Posts: 10278
Joined: Jun 6, 2015
Location: Paris
GameRanger ID: 5529322

Re: The problem with walls

Post by Kaiserklein »

Yea like typically pushing in a jap base full of ranged inf and even flaming arrows is a pain, you might lose if you try to commit there with cav, while if you force him to push in the open it's easier
Image
Image
Image
LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
User avatar
India rsy
Jaeger
Donator 01
Posts: 2202
Joined: Feb 27, 2015
Location: Lashka

Re: The problem with walls

Post by rsy »

iwillspankyou wrote:I like the Jerom wall, cos its strategic and make sense. I do not like 3 layers of walls, - and I certainly don't like 7000hp walls, like Aztec can achieve in the later game. At that point it's not about who has the map or who made the best units, its only about who has the most unbreakable walls

What exactly is a jerom wall?
User avatar
Norway spanky4ever
Gendarme
iwillspankyou
Posts: 8389
Joined: Apr 13, 2015

Re: The problem with walls

Post by spanky4ever »

@rsy ask @momuuu he will give you expert advice on it :biggrin:
Hippocrits are the worst of animals. I love elifants.
Tunisia iLolicon
Musketeer
Posts: 54
Joined: Jul 14, 2016
ESO: iLolicon

Re: The problem with walls

Post by iLolicon »

Just make pillars un-deletable, like the same as British manors houses. Probably wall spam would be a lot less viable if you had to pay the actual resources.
=
User avatar
Germany yemshi
Jaeger
Posts: 2311
Joined: Jun 3, 2015
ESO: yemshi
Location: Germany

Re: The problem with walls

  • Quote

Post by yemshi »

rsy wrote:
iwillspankyou wrote:I like the Jerom wall, cos its strategic and make sense. I do not like 3 layers of walls, - and I certainly don't like 7000hp walls, like Aztec can achieve in the later game. At that point it's not about who has the map or who made the best units, its only about who has the most unbreakable walls

What exactly is a jerom wall?


A single gate/wall segment between a house/bank/TC/ whatever. Costs 55w and allows you to save your skirms vs the 5 huss raid.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 17 guests

Which top 10 players do you wish to see listed?

All-time

Active last two weeks

Active last month

Supremacy

Treaty

Official

ESOC Patch

Treaty Patch

1v1 Elo

2v2 Elo

3v3 Elo

Power Rating

Which streams do you wish to see listed?

Twitch

Age of Empires III

Age of Empires IV