Australia Kawapasaka
Lancer
Donator 10
Posts: 573
Location: Wales (new, south)

21 Oct 2019, 00:59

Not sure if there's been a thread on this before, couldn't find one at least. Curious to hear everyone's opinions: What do you think is the most one-sided, hopeless civ matchup in the game, and why?
Image
User avatar
Canada dansil92
Lancer
Posts: 641
ESO: dansil92

21 Oct 2019, 01:00

Kawapasaka wrote:Not sure if there's been a thread on this before, couldn't find one at least. Curious to hear everyone's opinions: What do you think is the most one-sided, hopeless matchup in the game, and why?


RE or EP?

Spain vs china on a 3 tp livestock map is my bet on current ep

Otto v dutch on RE imo

Maybe iro v Sioux? Idk i think otto / dutch is still worse
Image
:hehe: :hehe: :hehe:
Australia Kawapasaka
Lancer
Donator 10
Posts: 573
Location: Wales (new, south)

21 Oct 2019, 01:03

dansil92 wrote:
Kawapasaka wrote:Not sure if there's been a thread on this before, couldn't find one at least. Curious to hear everyone's opinions: What do you think is the most one-sided, hopeless matchup in the game, and why?


RE or EP?

Spain vs china on a 3 tp livestock map is my bet on current ep

Otto v dutch on RE imo

Maybe iro v Sioux? Idk i think otto / dutch is still worse


Yeah, EP, otherwise I think it would just be a ton of Otto-[civ] and Iro-[civ]

Map is important too yeah, should specify that I guess.
Image
User avatar
Kiribati SirCallen
Gendarme
Posts: 8061
ESO: SirCallen
Location: Midwest best west

21 Oct 2019, 01:13

I want to say Spain vs Dutch, bad for Dutch
and the giving famishes the craving
sweet thames, run softly, til I end my song

The shepherd's staff's tantalus around my neck

let the water
touch the tongue
User avatar
Finland somppukunkku
Jaeger
Donator 02
Posts: 2601

21 Oct 2019, 01:17

SirCallen wrote:I want to say Spain vs Dutch, bad for Dutch

Its only cause most of the people make 5 banks they can't defend instead of max 3 and actually hold the push....
Co-Founder of Somali Kabuli Gaming
Homo management SKG
Spain pérez
Musketeer
Posts: 86
ESO: Pérez
Location: Spain

21 Oct 2019, 01:40

i would say, azzy vs sioux in safe tp map, just no way to win as azzy.
User avatar
United States of America IAmSoldieR
Howdah
Donator 03
Posts: 1780
ESO: SoldieR
Location: Chi City

21 Oct 2019, 01:46

Hmm.. really?
User avatar
Canada Mitoe
ESOC Media Team
EWTNWC LAN Top 8
Posts: 4198
ESO: Mitoe
GameRanger ID: 346407

21 Oct 2019, 02:09

Piroshiki vs H2O was always unwinnable for H2O
User avatar
Kiribati SirCallen
Gendarme
Posts: 8061
ESO: SirCallen
Location: Midwest best west

21 Oct 2019, 02:31

Im having a difficult time coming up with answers (on EP and EP maps) because traditionally "worst MU" means the game is easily lost before it can become outplay-able at equal skill. Tons of hunts and CM and stagecoach maps (and aggro jap) and occasionally 70w boats and more occasionally lots of walls means defenders can defend and aggressors can scale until there is a point either player can outplay, even if disadvantaged. It really becomes map and card dependent, and what the statuses of the natural resources are.

There are lots of "NR 10" EP memes but it adds subtly/finesse to the game, less brute force.

Chess AIs prefer positions with the most possible legal moves.
and the giving famishes the craving
sweet thames, run softly, til I end my song

The shepherd's staff's tantalus around my neck

let the water
touch the tongue
User avatar
Germany Lukas_L99
Howdah
Donator 01
Posts: 1499
ESO: Lukas_L99
Location: Frankfurt

21 Oct 2019, 02:40

Otto-Sioux maybe, if Sioux goes for the right build and microes well.
Australia Kawapasaka
Lancer
Donator 10
Posts: 573
Location: Wales (new, south)

21 Oct 2019, 02:45

I'm feeling sioux-china at the moment, personally. Don't even think trying to abuse walls would be useful. Maybe keshiks hold the secrets :maniac:
Image
User avatar
Kiribati SirCallen
Gendarme
Posts: 8061
ESO: SirCallen
Location: Midwest best west

21 Oct 2019, 03:09

Kawapasaka wrote:I'm feeling sioux-china at the moment, personally. Don't even think trying to abuse walls would be useful. Maybe keshiks hold the secrets :maniac:

Possibly, but if China can hold out until both Manchus and repelling volley are in, they stand a chance. Sioux's big engagement is very dependent on open land. China can maybe even semi FI on a livestock map abusing that fact. But Sioux can baby dance with map. But if Sioux baby dances, they could be vulnerable.

Let's face it: on EP there may be favorable and unfavorable MUs, but it's so close that the map plays such a huge part in it. MUs aren't so imbalanced that counter strats can't be executed, and that's very important. An unfavorable MU still requires the favored civilization to adapt accordingly to their opponent, and we stray further from MU and more into player experience/ability/unknown factors (like treasuring, scouting).
and the giving famishes the craving
sweet thames, run softly, til I end my song

The shepherd's staff's tantalus around my neck

let the water
touch the tongue
Australia Kawapasaka
Lancer
Donator 10
Posts: 573
Location: Wales (new, south)

21 Oct 2019, 03:39

SirCallen wrote:
Kawapasaka wrote:I'm feeling sioux-china at the moment, personally. Don't even think trying to abuse walls would be useful. Maybe keshiks hold the secrets :maniac:

Possibly, but if China can hold out until both Manchus and repelling volley are in, they stand a chance. Sioux's big engagement is very dependent on open land. China can maybe even semi FI on a livestock map abusing that fact. But Sioux can baby dance with map. But if Sioux baby dances, they could be vulnerable.

Let's face it: on EP there may be favorable and unfavorable MUs, but it's so close that the map plays such a huge part in it. MUs aren't so imbalanced that counter strats can't be executed, and that's very important. An unfavorable MU still requires the favored civilization to adapt accordingly to their opponent, and we stray further from MU and more into player experience/ability/unknown factors (like treasuring, scouting).


Very true, in hindsight "hopeless" is a bit dramatic of a term to describe something that is realistically, say, 35-65 at the worst. Shouldn't be making too many excuses for losses.
Image
User avatar
Kiribati SirCallen
Gendarme
Posts: 8061
ESO: SirCallen
Location: Midwest best west

21 Oct 2019, 03:43

That's the shtick - nearly every game I lose I know Kaiser or Mitoe or Hazza or someone better could have won it, or me if I was given a do-over.

While I love to complain, it irks me when people complain.

Hmmm, maybe I should apply this to my personal life...
and the giving famishes the craving
sweet thames, run softly, til I end my song

The shepherd's staff's tantalus around my neck

let the water
touch the tongue
User avatar
France Rikikipu
ESOC Maps Team
Posts: 1590
ESO: p-of
Location: In your base

21 Oct 2019, 06:46

On RE, dutch vs brit is really complicated for dutch I feel
France flontier
Dragoon
Posts: 254
ESO: Flontier

21 Oct 2019, 07:22

German spain
Great Britain Hazza54321
Gendarme
Donator 01
Posts: 6180

21 Oct 2019, 07:23

Port vs iro , port vs china , port vs spain, spain vs india , spain vs german, jap vs aztec, aztec vs sioux
User avatar
Kiribati jesus3
Howdah
Posts: 1431

21 Oct 2019, 07:43

Jap vs Spain is a huge load of crap imo
Australia Kawapasaka
Lancer
Donator 10
Posts: 573
Location: Wales (new, south)

21 Oct 2019, 07:44

jesus3 wrote:Jap vs Spain is a huge load of crap imo


For whom?
Image
Great Britain Hazza54321
Gendarme
Donator 01
Posts: 6180

21 Oct 2019, 07:51

I always thought that MU as even
User avatar
Serbia ShinkuroYukinari
Musketeer
Posts: 82
ESO: ShinkuroYukinari

21 Oct 2019, 07:59

Portugal vs anything on RE :D
First get to Age 4, then complain about Bulgaria :hehe:
User avatar
Kiribati jesus3
Howdah
Posts: 1431

21 Oct 2019, 08:27

Kawapasaka wrote:
jesus3 wrote:Jap vs Spain is a huge load of crap imo


For whom?


I've gotten used to Jap getting steamrolled if Spain strikes early enough, but I could be mistaken
User avatar
Malawi princeofcarthage
Retired Contributor
Posts: 1789
ESO: Princeofcarthage
Location: Milky Way!

21 Oct 2019, 09:06

ShinkuroYukinari wrote:Portugal vs anything on RE :D

@Aizamk
Image
Image
Image
No Flag Astaroth
Skirmisher
Posts: 166

21 Oct 2019, 09:16

jesus3 wrote:
Kawapasaka wrote:
jesus3 wrote:Jap vs Spain is a huge load of crap imo


For whom?


I've gotten used to Jap getting steamrolled if Spain strikes early enough, but I could be mistaken

I feel Japan can win with a very specific build: age 2 double rax ashi in base defense, like 600w 4v 600g CM or 5 ashi or daimyo. All buildings behind TC if possible, wall a bit to delay. Upgrade your vills right before the fight. Focus TC on falcs.

Once he is almost underneath your TC, pull all vills to tank, call all MM, flank with ashi and snare with clubs, GG.

If he doesn't push and just booms or masses, follow him asap into ashi Nagi FA.
User avatar
Kiribati jesus3
Howdah
Posts: 1431

21 Oct 2019, 09:31

Well, yes. A strong musk mass with few cav and villager-pull if necessary is the go-to strat vs Spain with any civ when in doubt tbh. My point is that Jap is fairly slow early on and Spain can push pretty fast with falconets guarded by rods/pikes and hus. I'm not even sure that jap even gets all the shipments you've listed before dying. It's at least a mirror of my struggles as Jap vs Spain. In theory, you know what to do. In reality, Spain strikes way too early

Forum Info

Return to “General”



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests