Potential EP Sioux Update
-
- Gendarme
- Posts: 5996
- Joined: Jun 4, 2019
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
Its still slightly ugly. Its prettier when you can balance a civ by just changing stats, crate starts or shipments.
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
It is possible for the shipment to increase deliveries of bison shipments by X units, though the logic would technically be done on each bison shipment. This also means that each bison shipment can be set to deliver a different number of extra bisons, effectively increasing deliveries by a percentage, if desired. Note that, in any case, the bison count displayed on card icon cannot dynamically change, so it would show (arguably) incorrect numbers after activating this effect.zoom wrote:I want to ask Eaglemut whether it were technically possible to implement the following, so I might as well do it here:
– "Great Hunter" now increases deliveries of bison shipments by X% or X units"
Not possible; units cannot naturally die from hp degeneration.– Teepees now lose 5hp per second, self-destructing when reaching 0hp
Depending on the definition of "tactical nuke", this should be possible as a targeted area-of-effect power.kaister wrote:Why not add a tactical nuke for 3k gold?
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
I would go with 450w. 400w is super cheap.
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
One specific thing I'd thought of for sioux would be an age IV farm card something like "3 Sisters" (a farming technique developed and widely used by the Sioux people) for like 30-40% to farms. It wouldn't be super relevant most games but would at least give them a lategame way to get some vestige of food eco after hunts are gone
- gamevideo113
- Howdah
- Posts: 1899
- Joined: Apr 26, 2017
- ESO: gamevideo113
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
Yeah, Sioux really need a boost to their lategame gathering. Either another farm upgrade card, or an infinite bison shipment in IV, which imo would be worth sending, even multiple times, because by the time you enter the lategame you'll have a lot of upgrades on your hunters:dansil92 wrote:One specific thing I'd thought of for sioux would be an age IV farm card something like "3 Sisters" (a farming technique developed and widely used by the Sioux people) for like 30-40% to farms. It wouldn't be super relevant most games but would at least give them a lategame way to get some vestige of food eco after hunts are gone
Sioux Hunting Upgrades
I think it could even be made the argument that the civ losing scaling in late fortress is physiological, and doesn't need to be adressed specifically (by the way - there are also cards for that, like Mustangs and Adoption). It makes sense for native civs to be interested in aging anyway because they have significantly cheaper upgrades, and get a better power spike out of the age up compared to euro.
[Some people aspire to be pr30+, some people aspire to have fun, and some people aspire to play 3v3 Deccan.] - vividlyplain - 2019
Who (nationality) rape ?
stupid logic. noob players can say op?
toxic, Insult, Racism ?
stupid logic. noob players can say op?
toxic, Insult, Racism ?
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
What is so strange about Sioux is just how many late game techs they have. Horsemanship, gun trade, bonepipe armour, etc. But then have literally 0 reason to go that late in the game and no eco techs to allow them to even use their potential. Really disappointing tbh
-
- Pro Player
- Posts: 10282
- Joined: Jun 6, 2015
- Location: Paris
- GameRanger ID: 5529322
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
We're not removing the snare, and we're not keeping 30% rr, unless we want a stupid warchief.zoom wrote:It's only happening if we replace it and the heavy cavalry tag with snare removal, which seems undesirable. Players were pretty clear about 10% resistance and the heavy cavalry tag being far too much.Kaiserklein wrote:Yeah please let's stop wasting time and energy and focus on actual stuff.
So how about reverting the weird 30% rr on warchief
LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
- [Armag] diarouga
- Ninja
- Posts: 12710
- Joined: Feb 26, 2015
- ESO: diarouga
- Location: France
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
Wtf ? We're asknig for a 30% RR revert and the "only" option is to remove snare ?Kaiserklein wrote:We're not removing the snare, and we're not keeping 30% rr, unless we want a stupid warchief.zoom wrote:It's only happening if we replace it and the heavy cavalry tag with snare removal, which seems undesirable. Players were pretty clear about 10% resistance and the heavy cavalry tag being far too much.Kaiserklein wrote:Yeah please let's stop wasting time and energy and focus on actual stuff.
So how about reverting the weird 30% rr on warchief
EP logic ????
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
Great Hunter increasing bison shipment power is ugly to you? Yikes! I don't mind simply tuning it to 30%, which I also suggested to Mitoe. Other than that, in terms of effect, it's the best option that I've seen. I strongly dislike any change that would make bison shipments less viable.deleted_user wrote:Oof not gonna lie those are ugly changes
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
Don't worry. I will be testing transfering the gather-aura to one of the Teepee upgrade shipments, whenever this revamp happens.gamevideo113 wrote:Yeah, Sioux really need a boost to their lategame gathering. Either another farm upgrade card, or an infinite bison shipment in IV, which imo would be worth sending, even multiple times, because by the time you enter the lategame you'll have a lot of upgrades on your hunters:dansil92 wrote:One specific thing I'd thought of for sioux would be an age IV farm card something like "3 Sisters" (a farming technique developed and widely used by the Sioux people) for like 30-40% to farms. It wouldn't be super relevant most games but would at least give them a lategame way to get some vestige of food eco after hunts are goneI can also see that Age4 is rarely reached in 1v1 so an Age4 change would probably have no impact in the current competitive scene, but i believe that the civ still needs a lategame overhaul.Sioux Hunting Upgrades
I think it could even be made the argument that the civ losing scaling in late fortress is physiological, and doesn't need to be adressed specifically (by the way - there are also cards for that, like Mustangs and Adoption). It makes sense for native civs to be interested in aging anyway because they have significantly cheaper upgrades, and get a better power spike out of the age up compared to euro.
-
- Pro Player
- Posts: 8050
- Joined: May 4, 2015
- ESO: PrinceofBabu
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
please dontzoom wrote:DW. I will be transfering the gather-aura to one of the Teepee upgrade shipments, whenever this revamp happens.gamevideo113 wrote:Yeah, Sioux really need a boost to their lategame gathering. Either another farm upgrade card, or an infinite bison shipment in IV, which imo would be worth sending, even multiple times, because by the time you enter the lategame you'll have a lot of upgrades on your hunters:dansil92 wrote:One specific thing I'd thought of for sioux would be an age IV farm card something like "3 Sisters" (a farming technique developed and widely used by the Sioux people) for like 30-40% to farms. It wouldn't be super relevant most games but would at least give them a lategame way to get some vestige of food eco after hunts are goneI can also see that Age4 is rarely reached in 1v1 so an Age4 change would probably have no impact in the current competitive scene, but i believe that the civ still needs a lategame overhaul.Sioux Hunting Upgrades
I think it could even be made the argument that the civ losing scaling in late fortress is physiological, and doesn't need to be adressed specifically (by the way - there are also cards for that, like Mustangs and Adoption). It makes sense for native civs to be interested in aging anyway because they have significantly cheaper upgrades, and get a better power spike out of the age up compared to euro.
Re: Potential Sioux Update
Fuck me; it's "Black Arrow", isn't it?zoom wrote:Presumably so – until EP7, where it most likely would now only take tweaking the numbers as planned, to make the civilization a little stronger and a little less unbreakable, overall.Mitoe wrote:Yeah I can respect that, it just seems like the gather rate aura wasn't working overall and always had to receive more and more changes every single patch. The cost decrease hopefully will keep them relevant.EAGLEMUT wrote:I actually liked that. Teepees feeling more like a core feature of the civ doesn't seem like bad design in itself at all, that actually feels like what they always should've been. You don't see players complain that building houses every game is a no-brainer with other civilizations. Teepees can be the equivalent of that, for Sioux. Besides, the real decision-making is in where you're going to build them and whether you're going to delete them to move somewhere else.
That said, eco aura is obviously not the only way of achieving viable teepees. I just wanted to underline that the viability of teepees is something I enjoyed, and I hope these changes don't result in taking them out of the game again.
As far as I can tell, the (logical) problem was never that you would be building Teepees every game; it's that the feature was so poorly implemented, that it meant that every game you would build as many Teepees as you possibly could, like a tumor attached to your starting Town Center, and spawn-camp until your broken "Broken Arrow" Dog Soldier big-button came in at 14 minutes. There was consideration neither as to how many you would build, nor where you would build them. Whether you like it is a separate issue, but logically it's not any different from building houses, other than being unique to the civilization, is it?
If I weren't such a slow thinker, we could have had this version a long time ago.
: (
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
It strikes me as a good compromise, to satisfy the players who like the aura (which I have found comprise a significant category), and does something to help later scaling, which the civilization seems to sorely need. Over the years, I've seen lots of people suggesting doing exactly that, too. Testing it, then polling it, seems like a reasonable thing to do. What's so bad about that plan?Hazza54321 wrote:please dontzoom wrote:DW. I will be transfering the gather-aura to one of the Teepee upgrade shipments, whenever this revamp happens.Show hidden quotes
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
5v
wakina 18 range -> 20 range
rifle rider gets 20rr instead of melee resist
this is my whole list of things i would change to ep7 sioux
wakina 18 range -> 20 range
rifle rider gets 20rr instead of melee resist
this is my whole list of things i would change to ep7 sioux
- chronique
- Advanced Player
- Posts: 2060
- Joined: Jul 4, 2015
- ESO: poissondu44
- Location: France
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
No, RR need to be widely countered by skirm, this unit is a f**** gateling lol.dansil92 wrote: rifle rider gets 20rr instead of melee resist
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
It's 220 res unit and gets one shotted by like 10 skirms it's bloody useless right nowchronique wrote:No, RR need to be widely countered by skirm, this unit is a f**** gateling lol.dansil92 wrote: rifle rider gets 20rr instead of melee resist
-
- Pro Player
- Posts: 10282
- Joined: Jun 6, 2015
- Location: Paris
- GameRanger ID: 5529322
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
No it's not useless, whenever it's vs musk/huss kind of stuff it's quite an OP unit. Just a terrible unit when goons are involved basically. If they have RI / HI / cav, you can go pure axe + rr and it's essentially not counterable.
Doesn't need 20% rr, also I think it's cheaper on EP already.
Also giving wakinas 20 range would probably make them OP. Right now the unit is strong already because it has an insane attack for its cost, but its lower range means you can't really go for skirm wars. You need some axe in front basically, and then your wakinas just deal a ton of damage. I don't think we want to change that.
Doesn't need 20% rr, also I think it's cheaper on EP already.
Also giving wakinas 20 range would probably make them OP. Right now the unit is strong already because it has an insane attack for its cost, but its lower range means you can't really go for skirm wars. You need some axe in front basically, and then your wakinas just deal a ton of damage. I don't think we want to change that.
LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
- chronique
- Advanced Player
- Posts: 2060
- Joined: Jul 4, 2015
- ESO: poissondu44
- Location: France
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
If iam not wrong this unit cost 120f 90g now, and like kaiser said, ask otto/spain player if rr are usless ^^.dansil92 wrote:
It's 220 res unit and gets one shotted by like 10 skirms it's bloody useless right now
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
Lol imagine Otto vs Sioux with Rifle riders having 20 % rr.
-
- Pro Player
- Posts: 8050
- Joined: May 4, 2015
- ESO: PrinceofBabu
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
They already have one for 1.5k foodkaister wrote:Why not add a tactical nuke for 3k gold?zoom wrote:I want to ask Eaglemut whether it were technically possible to implement the following, so I might as well do it here:
– "Great Hunter" now increases deliveries of bison shipments by X% or X units"
– Teepees now lose 5hp per second, self-destructing when reaching 0hp
- Aykin Haraka
- Howdah
- Posts: 1016
- Joined: Jul 27, 2016
- ESO: aykin
Re: Potential EP Sioux Update
still arguing about futures shit changes to apply to a shit game
xd
xd
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 13 guests