User avatar
Belgium LegalPenguin
Musketeer
Posts: 67
ESO: LegalPenguin
Location: Ghent

22 May 2020, 19:21

harcha wrote:you could give the wagon same hp as the actual fort so that it is just as viable to use it as a tank

Maybe add the same attack as the fort? Could be good.
Is it a bird? Is it a plane? No, it's ...
User avatar
Argentina Jotunir
Skirmisher
Posts: 148
Location: Argentina

23 May 2020, 00:20

LegalPenguin wrote:
harcha wrote:you could give the wagon same hp as the actual fort so that it is just as viable to use it as a tank

Maybe add the same attack as the fort? Could be good.


War Wagon? :lol:
No Flag helln00
Skirmisher
Posts: 132
ESO: helln00

23 May 2020, 01:40

How about instead of thinking about shipments at all, we just have it as an age up option to age 3, that sends a wagon and also adds it as a build option
User avatar
Holy See Imperial Noob
Lancer
Posts: 760
Location: bacc, I guess

23 May 2020, 02:48

You mean the campaign 1000 res industrial age-up option?
No Flag helln00
Skirmisher
Posts: 132
ESO: helln00

23 May 2020, 03:29

yes but to age 3
User avatar
Kiribati SirCallen
Ninja
Donator 03
Posts: 10164
ESO: DJ2Strong
Location: Midwest best west

23 May 2020, 05:42

Too strong aging to III. It's 1k res value. Would need to be a IV option. Even that feels pretty strong.
:mds:
Defunct Analyst. Amateur de-tilter. King of Catan. Father to three beautiful smurfs :smile:
User avatar
Canada dansil92
ESOC Maps Team
Posts: 1077
ESO: dansil92

23 May 2020, 15:49

more euro buffs
https://eso-community.net/viewtopic.php?p=441858#p441857
My official maps thread


There is a master sergeant level solution for every PR 40 problem.
-Le Hussard sur le toit
User avatar
Germany Plantinator
Skirmisher
Posts: 125
ESO: Plantinator

23 May 2020, 15:54

dansil92 wrote:more euro buffs


-everyone, 19th century
User avatar
Malawi princeofcarthage
Retired Contributor
Posts: 3066
ESO: Princeofcarthage
Location: Milky Way!

23 May 2020, 16:50

You shouldn't be more than pr 16 if you are losing fort wagon. (Rarely if you lose that's acceptable)
:bigs: :bigs: :bigs:
User avatar
France [Armag] diarouga
Ninja
NWC LAN Gold
Posts: 11124
ESO: diarouga
Location: France

23 May 2020, 18:27

princeofcarthage wrote:You shouldn't be more than pr 16 if you are losing fort wagon. (Rarely if you lose that's acceptable)

You shouldn't be more than pr26 if you (or your opponent) are building a fort in the middle of the map.
Image
User avatar
United States of America Squamiger
Dragoon
Posts: 273
ESO: Squamiger

23 May 2020, 18:36

forts are good they way they are. super risky to put out on the map, but possibly worth it in some situations. much safer to drop it in your base, but only relevant for certain niche plays like revolution or FI. that's fine, that's just how some cards should be in AoE3. if every single card had the same flexibility and power as something like 9 uhlans, this would just be a different game
ajabu ya kondoo kucheka kioo
User avatar
Netherlands Goodspeed
Retired Contributor
Posts: 9444

23 May 2020, 18:37

Fort is already a decent shipment and has been underused for years imo. There are a lot of situations where it's viable. Buffing it would probably be a mistake.
User avatar
Malawi princeofcarthage
Retired Contributor
Posts: 3066
ESO: Princeofcarthage
Location: Milky Way!

23 May 2020, 19:07

[Armag] diarouga wrote:
princeofcarthage wrote:You shouldn't be more than pr 16 if you are losing fort wagon. (Rarely if you lose that's acceptable)

You shouldn't be more than pr26 if you (or your opponent) are building a fort in the middle of the map.

That is not the point though?
:bigs: :bigs: :bigs:
User avatar
Kiribati SirCallen
Ninja
Donator 03
Posts: 10164
ESO: DJ2Strong
Location: Midwest best west

23 May 2020, 19:11

[Armag] diarouga wrote:
princeofcarthage wrote:You shouldn't be more than pr 16 if you are losing fort wagon. (Rarely if you lose that's acceptable)

You shouldn't be more than pr26 if you (or your opponent) are building a fort in the middle of the map.

Stop gatekeeping forts lol
:mds:
Defunct Analyst. Amateur de-tilter. King of Catan. Father to three beautiful smurfs :smile:
User avatar
France Kaiserklein
Pro Player
Posts: 8387
Location: Paris
GameRanger ID: 5529322

23 May 2020, 19:26

Goodspeed wrote:Fort is already a decent shipment and has been underused for years imo. There are a lot of situations where it's viable. Buffing it would probably be a mistake.

Well, just no
Can sirmusket calculate 5x - x??
[Armag] diarouga wrote:Playing Aztec is a 10% handicap

LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
User avatar
Netherlands Goodspeed
Retired Contributor
Posts: 9444

23 May 2020, 19:33

Ok
User avatar
France Kaiserklein
Pro Player
Posts: 8387
Location: Paris
GameRanger ID: 5529322

23 May 2020, 19:48

I agree buffing it isn't necessary though. But I think I explained ITT why forts aren't good atm in almost every case. I'm not sure what makes you think the opposite?
Can sirmusket calculate 5x - x??
[Armag] diarouga wrote:Playing Aztec is a 10% handicap

LoOk_tOm wrote:I have something in particular against Kaisar (GERMANY NOOB mercenary LAMME FOREVER) And the other people (noobs) like suck kaiser ... just this ..
Germany lordraphael
Pro Player
EWTNWC LAN SilverAdvanced Division WinnerDonator 01
Posts: 2448

23 May 2020, 19:50

theres 3 major obstacles why forts are not viable.
1) it takes an age 3 card slot, in a std you basically dont wanna have a fort as an age 3 shipment.
2) it takes aproxximately 2 minutes after its arrived to give any form of value, while most other shipments have an immediate impact
3) I go into a game assuming im the better player and that i can outplay/ be in control of the game with my unit control and macro, so I dont need a fort to get map control, i can just use my army, which is even mobile and doesnt lock me into one place. When you have map control anyways a fort doesnt add much value

Of course theres niche situations when youd want to have a fort/ be able to send one but then see point 1) and 2). Id only conisder having a fort in deck with 2 civilisations really: Port and ottoman maybe spain too. All other civs either dont scale to well into the late game, so they dont want to prolong the game anyways or should have enough map presence just with the army so that they dont need to take the gamble of getting a fort up.
French doesnt wanna tc boom in 99 % of all cases and they have a strong midgame where they often get mapctrl anyways, same applies to germany+ ger doesnt even scale well into lategame ( i define lategame as being maxed out on vills) .
Dutch could want a fort in certain mus, but getting up a fort in a good position as dutch is kind of impossible, and having it inbase doesnt give you much in most mus,
Russia.. why would russia want a fort ? they have mapctrl anyways in most situations
THen theres brits, its kind of the same for them as it is for dutch+ they eat hunt even faster so a fort will only be good for a limited amount of time unless its in an insane spot.
breeze wrote:they cant even guess how much f***ing piece of stupid retarded they look they are trying to give lesson to people who are over pr35 and know the best mu. im pretty sure that we need a page that only pr30+ post and then we could have a nice discussins.
Germany lordraphael
Pro Player
EWTNWC LAN SilverAdvanced Division WinnerDonator 01
Posts: 2448

23 May 2020, 19:52

Kaiserklein wrote:I agree buffing it isn't necessary though. But I think I explained ITT why forts aren't good atm in almost every case. I'm not sure what makes you think the opposite?

most likely not, but maybe it should unlock the ability to build one. if you lose a wagon or it gets sieged down at least you have somewhat of an compensation.
breeze wrote:they cant even guess how much f***ing piece of stupid retarded they look they are trying to give lesson to people who are over pr35 and know the best mu. im pretty sure that we need a page that only pr30+ post and then we could have a nice discussins.
User avatar
Netherlands Goodspeed
Retired Contributor
Posts: 9444

23 May 2020, 20:07

I think you could consider a change where buildings that are being built don't take so much damage that they get 1-hit by just a couple of pikes sieging it. I've always found that to be silly design, and it's probably one of the main reaons people don't send fort.
User avatar
No Flag RefluxSemantic
Jaeger
Posts: 2865
ESO: NWC_fan_101

23 May 2020, 20:09

Raphael, I think you might only be looking at somewhat early uses of the fort. Except for specific strats, the most general usage of a fort is to secure the last hunts and mines on the map near the end of the game. If you can do that, the fort is arguably the single most effective shipment at that point of the game.

Its just a matter of getting the fort up and that is still pretty hard. There are scenarios where this would definitely seal the deal though. The problem might not even be the powerlevel, but that it is too niche; it only happens one in 20 games or so, and even then the situation where it is useful might not present itself. But when it does, the fort is game-winning.
:nwc: NWC fighting! :nwc:
User avatar
Canada Mitoe
Advanced Theory Craftsman
EWTNWC LAN Top 8EPL Reigning Champs
Posts: 4623
ESO: Mitoe
GameRanger ID: 346407

23 May 2020, 20:19

The Fort never goes up, and especially not in the spot you want it to go up. It's useless.
User avatar
Spain Snuden
Jaeger
Posts: 3134
ESO: Snuden
Location: x666 HQ

23 May 2020, 20:27

I can see how a fort could be viable on a few select maps and MU’s.
36: This herd, was not herded correctly towards his town center
Germany lordraphael
Pro Player
EWTNWC LAN SilverAdvanced Division WinnerDonator 01
Posts: 2448

23 May 2020, 20:35

RefluxSemantic wrote:Raphael, I think you might only be looking at somewhat early uses of the fort. Except for specific strats, the most general usage of a fort is to secure the last hunts and mines on the map near the end of the game. If you can do that, the fort is arguably the single most effective shipment at that point of the game.

Its just a matter of getting the fort up and that is still pretty hard. There are scenarios where this would definitely seal the deal though. The problem might not even be the powerlevel, but that it is too niche; it only happens one in 20 games or so, and even then the situation where it is useful might not present itself. But when it does, the fort is game-winning.

do i want to have a card taken in age 3 which could otherwise be a unit shipment or upgrade, just for the rare case that it comes down to having acces to the last natural ressources on the map ? Presuming it goes up in that spot where you want it to go up and not just get sniped down. Also that fort could be another unit shipment that help me control that spot anyways. Its a gamble and just not worth to have in your deck
breeze wrote:they cant even guess how much f***ing piece of stupid retarded they look they are trying to give lesson to people who are over pr35 and know the best mu. im pretty sure that we need a page that only pr30+ post and then we could have a nice discussins.
User avatar
Tuvalu gibson
Ninja
Posts: 10631
Location: USA

23 May 2020, 20:41

Yea no reason to have fort in deck unless youre doing into game with a strat that revolves around it, like a fast revolt where you think youll need it in base to hold, otherwise its just bad for the aforementioned reasons.

Forum Info

Return to “Strategy”



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests