II tournament

[spanky4ever]

How about a tournament, that is only age II, and no revolts?
I would support that And fund it aswell

[LopsidedFluff]

a tourney like this would definitely be refreshing

[Miyawaki Sakura]

Sadly, It would be more unfair than normal DE.

[look]

perfect format!

[Aykin Haraka]

i would play for this one

[moonshine]

me2 - if, i would play that as well.

Age2 botting for ever *FBTOUCHDOWN FBTOUCHDOWN*

[ocemilky]

Big Russia funded this post

[Squamiger]

Sadly, It would be more unfair than normal DE.

this is true. It's not going to go the way people think. age 2 is only rushy / aggressive / fun in normal gameplay because it can pay off vs. someone playing for age 3/4 and going greedy. But if the game is capped at age 2, there is literally never a reason to do anything except turtle super hard with walls and boom, because most civs just can't break turtles without artillery.

some civs have a slight advantage though. Otto and brits will be decent with good grens against walls. China can get crows. Dutch with vet halbs is potentially good.

But yea, look forward to a boring turtle fest if this format happens.

[SoldieR]

Early skirm, early goon, natives would play very interesting roles

[spanky4ever]

glad to c some likes to the idea;)

[spanky4ever]

lets goo, and the pot will be 500 dollars. if and when it will be?

[ocemilky]

Early skirm, early goon, natives would play very interesting roles

As an aside, does anybody know if team goons still give germany Vet WW or just std WW?

[ocemilky]

Sadly, It would be more unfair than normal DE.

this is true. It's not going to go the way people think. age 2 is only rushy / aggressive / fun in normal gameplay because it can pay off vs. someone playing for age 3/4 and going greedy. But if the game is capped at age 2, there is literally never a reason to do anything except turtle super hard with walls and boom, because most civs just can't break turtles without artillery.

some civs have a slight advantage though. Otto and brits will be decent with good grens against walls. China can get crows. Dutch with vet halbs is potentially good.

But yea, look forward to a boring turtle fest if this format happens.

Not so sure about that, since turtle pays off when you can tech up.

I think it'd be a blood bath because many civs can't make plantations without cards and even then it'd be pretty awful. Dutch would probably be one of the best with a long range skirm unit, potentially halbs, and up to 9 banks

[Squamiger]

Sadly, It would be more unfair than normal DE.

this is true. It's not going to go the way people think. age 2 is only rushy / aggressive / fun in normal gameplay because it can pay off vs. someone playing for age 3/4 and going greedy. But if the game is capped at age 2, there is literally never a reason to do anything except turtle super hard with walls and boom, because most civs just can't break turtles without artillery.

some civs have a slight advantage though. Otto and brits will be decent with good grens against walls. China can get crows. Dutch with vet halbs is potentially good.

But yea, look forward to a boring turtle fest if this format happens.

Not so sure about that, since turtle pays off when you can tech up.

I think it'd be a blood bath because many civs can't make plantations without cards and even then it'd be pretty awful. Dutch would probably be one of the best with a long range skirm unit, potentially halbs, and up to 9 banks

Turtling in an age2 capped game will absolutely pay off because it's the lowest risk strategy possible and it's extremely easy vs age 2 capped civs. You can't tech up, but neither can your opponent to get falcs or any kind of heavy siege. Investing heavily in walls is one of the few things you can invest in when you're age 2 capped. Players might opt to not do that out of good sportsmanship, but I can almost guarantee you that heavy walling is the default strategy in an age 2 capped game. You have to wall heavily because if you don't and your opponent does, you just auto-lose, so both players will wall heavily, and then spend many unfun hours trying to counter siege one another because auto-capping at age 2 is literally just an incomplete version of the game that doesn't actually produce a playable game. I'm not kidding, we might just see players resign bc they are out of time or bored.

Everyone will have the age 2 plantation card in deck, that will be mandatory for this format. decks will be full age 1 cards, full age 2 cards. Many of these cards benefit turtling, building hp, building speed, infinite eco cards, etc., that will bias the game even more toward turtling than it would already be just by virtue of being age 2 capped.

source: i've played age 2 capped games

there's a way to fix all this though, which is to ban walls.

[Mitoe]

I don’t think walls will be that good.

[Squamiger]

How do you deal with Dutch or Japan turtling behind layers of walls when you can't age for falcs, let alone mortars? Of course, a hard rush, but since the game is age 2 capped, your opponent will easily expect that. The only other option is to just start walling yourself. Prisoner's dilemma type logic says hard walling is the best choice most of the time in an age 2 capped game. And then, two players stuck in age 2 trying to push through each other's 10 layers of walls with pikemen starts to get really boring really fast.

I'd love to be proven wrong though! Lets see some games!

[ocemilky]

I feel like the payoff from turtling like that is to be able to tech up safely. Without teching up, you're giving up all the res on the map. What do you do when you've used both goldmines? Go onto plantations with a mega slow gather rate.. You'll get outmassed.

I think early pressure with map control wins the game. I'm keen to play a few games to test though, I've never done age 2 capped games so that would be quite fun.

[dansil92]

some civs have strong siege units age 2 so walls aren't a free win by any means. flamethrowers are extremely powerful when everyone is age capped, hell even flail elephants (though extremely meme) are pretty scary. Grens have their place as well. Personally I think hausa would be really solid because they can get 3 tcs, have pop efficient units and don't have to worry about cannons. Walls definitely are the correct play against civs with shit age 2 siege options (like haud) but you don't want to try that vs china imo

[Mitoe]

How do you deal with Dutch or Japan turtling behind layers of walls when you can't age for falcs, let alone mortars? Of course, a hard rush, but since the game is age 2 capped, your opponent will easily expect that. The only other option is to just start walling yourself. Prisoner's dilemma type logic says hard walling is the best choice most of the time in an age 2 capped game. And then, two players stuck in age 2 trying to push through each other's 10 layers of walls with pikemen starts to get really boring really fast.

I'd love to be proven wrong though! Lets see some games!

That's just normal Japan gameplay. You just siege their shrines instead and prepare a timing while booming with something like Stagecoach if the map allows.

Dutch just isn't that good in age 2. They're playable for sure, but their army is expensive and pikes aren't very good, even when carded.

I'm not sure about some of the newer civs though; I could see Inca being quite unbeatable sometimes, though I'm not even sure they need to wall.

[helln00]

civs with age 2 skirm access or equivalent power unit will be pretty strong

France, Ethiopia and US have early skirm access through card

Advance arsenal might be pretty good as well considering you wont have upgrades and skirms having CIR in age 2 moots all heavy infantry.

Dutch is arguably very strong if you are willing to commit to the logistician age up and get vet halbs in age 2

I agree that walls might not be that strong considering the payoff is pretty bad for a lot of civs since you cant build more TCs, your eco will only be able to grow linearly and ur units wont be upgraded

Civs that cant boom might try to wall or rush a boom civ but there would be little payoff to do the same against another civ that also cant boom.

the biggest winner of course is probably Japan or india since they have their near complete roster in age 2, decent upgrades, can just go to rice paddies when res runs out

[ocemilky]

Russia going stelet cav archer (wood cost) age 2.. maybe the most terrifying

[Squamiger]

ethio will probably be pretty good with early skirms and infinite in base goldmines

[Yukietti]

make it only legacy civs:) otherwise Inca will beat every civ

[Dennis234]

ethio will probably be pretty good with early skirms and infinite in base goldmines

hausa will be pretty good too :)

[callentournies]

Vet halb with four cards, triple carded skirm, 9 banks (2 more than 7).

Yeah, you’re lucky I’m homless (and can’t play!)