Laming and botting are…good actually??

[Black_Hole_Tree]

Rather than play sandbox so I can enjoy that sweet colonial atmosphere against AI, I’ve been copying every viable cheap op exploit I can find, starting with the ones that require the least effort. Post some here with vid if you want to help elevate me from 1100 ELO. Other players accuse me of laming and botting, and I know these are valid criticisms, but how do win a ranked match besides? Once I get close to 1200, better players just out-micro me in spite of it.

Now pardon me while I meander about it. I’ve been steamrolled by Baja Rush (Mexico) a few times but a competent defense can resist it, which I’ve learned to copy successfully, if it’s expected. Same with Russia rekrut/strelet rush, both of which I’ve imitated to climb the ladder a bit, but their units are way too fragile. Spanish 12/10 naked FF falc rush will work against some n00bs, as will Otto and Brit church card plays. Sometimes American bandits + early Highlanders will work. Maybe this pattern will help you tell me what my stinkin’ problem is. I’m not really interested in trying Asian, Med, or African civs but I’d be open to learning some OP Aztec rushes. Callen’s 41v age 2 has been of particular interest to me, but I haven’t won with it…yet.

I posted this on the Microsoft forum but got little feedback from those casuals. I’m a n00b especially with micro but I’ve been playing since legacy release against bots because my internet connection has been terrible. Finally joining supremacy 1v1 has been a culture shock. I’m not a sore loser but it does suck some of the fun out of the game to be insulted when I win. Happy to see that happens in high level games too though.

[Black_Hole_Tree]

It’s shameful to admit, but if the game reaches 20 minutes I usually know I’ve lost. I just don’t have that kind of stamina yet, which is why I rely on rushes or all-or-nothing FFs or FIs. No need to reference me to the strategy wall, I’m there everyday and I also follow the greats on youtube. Some esoteric proven tips would be appreciated though, and recorded games.

[iNcog]

this is the right way to play rts. mechanics and game knowledge are for try hards. you know what you want and will do anything to get it. this is foundation for being the best

[Black_Hole_Tree]

this is the right way to play rts. mechanics and game knowledge are for try hards. you know what you want and will do anything to get it. this is foundation for being the best

I appreciate your permission (seriously) to be ruthless. I wonder which of my lame strategies you would say has the most potential, or if you have any you've been using. Tips for game longevity would help me a lot, too.

[iNcog]

I don't play as of right now, there are definitely better people to ask for specifics. but boy do I support your mentality

[Squamiger]

I mean, yea, agreed. Don't hate the player hate the game. Your goal should be to win by any means possible, any idea about playing "fairly" is a luxury that only the very best players like Kaiser can afford. Plus, if you lame and bot, you will rise in Elo, which means you will face better and better players. So you will actually improve faster in all aspects of the game, because you will be pushed and challenged more.

This is why I've also said we should have a no rules, no civ bans tournament, just to see what happens. Viewers will hate it but whatever. A WCG 2008 style tourney where you can just play Otto 7 games in a row if you want, every match. This will do 3 things:

1. we will actually see who cares about winning AOE3 DE in 2025 the most
2. This will also clarify for real what the best and most OP civs and builds are
3. This will determine who is truly the best at mechanics and RTS skills, because once everyone is just playing the same civ and build over and over, the only difference will come down to mechanics. GK / civ pools are an enforced crutch by ESOC tourney formats

[alistairpeter]

Maybe you can be Kerimbs fifth wife

[Black_Hole_Tree]

Maybe you can be Kerimbs fifth wife

I will do disgusting things to improve my elo. Keep that in mind if you’re open to revealing to me a dark magic secret.

That said I’ve just discovered that there’s an archive of recorded games on this forum and it’s helping me a lot.

[Black_Hole_Tree]

you can just play Otto 7 games in a row if you want, every match…the best and most OP civs

Is this…your advice? Janrushmax? Is that what you do? No shade, do you mix in grens?

[callentournies]

these strats are cheesy and to me simple but they require you to macro and get good treasures -- are you up to that incredible task?

Spanish 12/10 -- 3v, capitalism, 700c, 700w, 2 Falc -- only build tp age 1. prio food/XP tres in age 1. you need some XP tres to ship Falc asap in age 3, but if done, they will be seiging enemy TC at 7:30. age with pike or bow or huss idk. make musks from rax. you never make another vill, stay on 12. you don't make a house in transition or anything until 700w. send 2v forward when 700w arrive to make rax and start prodding musks asap.

Otto 2 rax Jan rush (with eco) -- 3v, capitalism, 5v, 700w, 5 Jan/3 huss/spice trade -- start TP + mosque. in transition to II chop wood for market, HD, and (two?) houses, I think. or maybe 1 house and get steel traps. depends on treasures and macro. you are shitter so keep it simple.

you should get 10 Jans out first batch. then maybe 6 or 7 second batch. but get TPs and stagecoach with 700w and keep making jans. instead of your 2 rax rush dying out it will get bigger and you can keep prodding 10 Jans at a time and randomly stack res to age, or add a 3rd rax, etc. shitter version is to do this rush with just crates. no capitalism or 5v.

unpunishable port FF -- feitorias, 700c, age 2c 2 cow (Eat the cows) -- only build a house in age 1 and age with 13v, prio a food tres, then wood/coin tres. chop for TP in transition to II but nothing further. build TP. macro to age off 700c, you only make two vills in age 2 before clicking up. age fast and ship fort first (porto forto) stack res for mm to protect fort constructing if necessary then just make vills and ship 1kw and these things because you are porto and have a forto. outscale your opponent. put ur TCs near each other. might require you to micro skirm goon (scary).

halb organ FF -- I think(?) you 10/10 with TP (prio food tres) chop for house in transition(?) age 500f ship 700c skip 700w fast age ship 8 halb then 3 organ then 1kw for prod facilities, I think. send ur 2nd TC very far forward. raid vills with organs and things. ask swisherguts what he does.

Otto FF -- 3v, 700c, 700w, 2 Falc/8jan/ -- start TP and mosque, age with 4 huss off 700c, build rax and make Jans and ship falcs. you can ship Jan's then falcs or falcs then Jan's then 1kc then mams or just macro for spurs after or idk. musketero falconetto.

Otto FF w/spurs -- 3v, 700c, 700w, 6 spahi -- do the same things but age slow with abuse. right click opponent.

watch kerimb games for Otto mosque FI

[Squamiger]

Is this…your advice? Janrushmax? Is that what you do? No shade, do you mix in grens?

when i am feeling the most tired and braindead but i still want to get in a few 1v1s, then yes. see callens post for the build.

Other good bot build is a haud rush: travois to house, chop/treasure 75w for TP in age 1, age with 14/20 vills. Fast age, chop wood for another house in transition. Send warhut forward, ship 4 kanyas followed by 7 aenna or 6 toma, train 5 toma or 5 aenna, and then use TC big button for 5 more tomahawks. Apply pressure and keep training units. Keep vills split about 80/20 on food to wood. Variations include sending 5v or 600w first for a more delayed timing. Keep up pressure till you can send conservative tactics, infantry attack, and infantry hp and mass tomahawks aenna and kanyas.

[ocemilky]

As others have said this will 100% improve your mechanics. You seem to already be doing your homework and watching recordings/looking up builds. Once you can apply the 'cheese strats' or the strongest meta strats consistently, you might have enough skill gain to do more typical builds at a much higher level (maybe from 1200 to 1500 level jump type thing).

Then once you've started improving on more typical builds and compositions (musk/huss or skirm/goon or dopp/ulhan type things), you can start to fuck around with more unconventional stuff.

It's fun to see unconventional builds when they're executed well by higher skilled players. I think DE in its current state has such a high amount of niche and unconventional builds that are yet to be explored, albiet some of the whacky ones are highly situational. But to do that you need to know your fundamentals not only to pull off your own strats, but to recognize what you're scouting your opponent doing.

It would be fun in 6 months time for you to review some of your own recordings from now and critique yourself to see your own improvement.

[Black_Hole_Tree]

@callentournies and @Squamiger I owe many future ELO points to you lads. For every game I win I will offer up incense and pour out a beer for you.

[callentournies]

@callentournies and @Squamiger I owe many future ELO points to you lads. For every game I win I will offer up incense and pour out a beer for you.

The best thing you can do is stream your journey

[aaryngend]

Botting? Just call it "playing vs AI" instead. Had me worried there for a second.

[ocemilky]

I assumed botting was playing otto

[aaryngend]

I assumed botting was playing otto

I didn't know 'botto' could be used as a verb as well

Thinking about it again, if other people accused him of botting I guess they meant that he played simple, braindead build orders even an AI with weak decision making and micro could reliably pull off.

[ocemilky]

Botter will soon be a noun for players playing otto hahah

@Black_Hole_Tree if you want strong cheese strats the simple ones are typically those that allow you to mass units without making production buildings. This is through cards and church techs, often with shadow tech stats.

Some main ones I can think of from the top of my head:

Dutch fort FI into 30 church musk, 5 church cav and 2 heavy cannon from HC

Otto fort FI with mosque army, Spahi and 2 bombard from HC, factories set onto bombards (use cheaper mosque card too, this is a kerimb special). You can eco up well with tc shipments

Spanish FF with forward tower into the church 13 guard halb + 2 falconets from HC (much more all-in and faster compared to most)

Brit FF with church highlanders and ship 2 falcs. Reasonably fast paced with the ability to eco up if needed. Start with TP and send GMT

Sweden (I've never done this but seen it a few times) church techs (one gives you halbs/speed and the other gives your infantry speed). You can pair this with Arsnela tech and the age 3 card that turns all your pike into halbs for super speedy halb split push

USA have a fun fast imperial into cowboys strat as well.

[Black_Hole_Tree]

This is through cards and church techs, often with shadow tech stats.

I'm finding that Brit, Otto, Spain church techs are outmaneuvered by colonial plays. This is part of the joy of the game; I lost today to some Indian artillery elephants while I thought I was being quick and clever rushing to fortress. Shoulda had some cav waiting for him. Scouting is not something that can be botted.

[ocemilky]

This is true. Often times you can get away with naked FF if you age up with the tower 200c, maybe you have to sink an age 3 shipment into an age 2 military shipment and pop with mm + explorer. Usually this is enough to get you through to 3 and more often if you're heading to 4 you want to ship that fort. Semi ffs are great for getting to 3 relatively safely, but delayed.

India's siege eles is another cheese strat if you scout a naked ff you can usually get away with doing. Lionheart has a recent video on this strat being executed well which you can find here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05rJwY3xQZU

Colonial plays can absolutely disrupt your naked FFs but that helps to develop your skills with timings. often if you can survive through that and adjust your strategy (maybe you can't afford the church techs right away but can ship other powerful age 3 shipments instead).

[Black_Hole_Tree]

Update on my journey. Bumped 100 elo points, using mostly Botto FI but also Brit GMT. Biggest challenge is knowing when to adjust my strategy, such as vs Baja. Big thanks for the help.