Remove coin and berrys upgrades of torp...

[Efraín]

And replace them with 5/4 villagers. The economy of those cards is what makes the Swedes have the best economy in the game and by far in a very short time.

I would like know all opinions, thanks.

[chronique]

No need this kind of standardisation.

[deleted_user]

Just scale back the effect of effects that are too effective until a balance is achieved.

Unfortunately, while I admire the design of Sweden, as a concept it is slightly imbal, because torps have to be so good so as to give Sweden an advantage until their torps run out, at which point their eco just haults. If their boom were standardized then there would be no reason to play them.

It's essentially the concept of fish in the role of the water eco, applied to land, except you don't get whales.

[n0el]

People will figure out how to play against Sweden, and when that happens they will be shit

[Efraín]

People will figure out how to play against Sweden, and when that happens they will be shit

Gl and hf.

[fei123456]

Just nerf the datas a bit. Sweden is insanely powerful in mid-game, but they're vulnerable to early pressure. Even Japan do much better against a rush.

[Squamiger]

People will figure out how to play against Sweden, and when that happens they will be shit

it seems sort of clear-- either rush really early, or wall up and go full kynesie-mode until their torps res runs out. the thing is, both these strats are just pretty hard and unfun for most civs. the whole game is designed around colonial and fortress age wars in 1v1, so when you have a civ like this that forces either an all-in rush or kynesie-mode, it's just kind of dumb

[Challenger_Marco]

No

[_DB_]

Do Torps also gather from mills and plantations?

[deleted_user]

Do Torps also gather from mills and plantations?

no

[[Armag] diarouga]

People will figure out how to play against Sweden, and when that happens they will be shit

it seems sort of clear-- either rush really early, or wall up and go full kynesie-mode until their torps res runs out. the thing is, both these strats are just pretty hard and unfun for most civs. the whole game is designed around colonial and fortress age wars in 1v1, so when you have a civ like this that forces either an all-in rush or kynesie-mode, it's just kind of dumb

Nah, do not rush Swe... Kynesie mode does stomp swe however, you're right.

[[Armag] diarouga]

And replace them with 5/4 villagers. The economy of those cards is what makes the Swedes have the best economy in the game and by far in a very short time.

I would like know all opinions, thanks.

As poisson said that's standardization, besides the berry card is simply bad for swe, so why would you nerf a shipment nobody sends ? And if you remove the torp mine upgrade, Swe is going to suck.

Anyway, as noel said, once people figure out how to play against swe, the full carolean style won't be viable at high level. You still have the mercenary play in fortress though, but at least it will be less lame.

[duckzilla]

Sweden in team games is nice. You can boom in relative safety to 20 Torps and send 1. Blueberries, 2. Faster coin gathering for Torps, 3. Blackberries. Your torps are equivalent to ~3 vills each and will gather ~14k food + 8k gold in the next minutes lol.

[iamgaming]

Your torps are equivalent to ~3 vills each

With Blueberry, a torp gathers food 0.67/s. With Engelsberg, a torp gathers coin 0.75/s. If you have a torp to gather an animal or several woods, then it can be compared to 2.5 vills w/o upgrade, but normally it can’t gather more than 2 vills.

[Efraín]

Your torps are equivalent to ~3 vills each

With Blueberry, a torp gathers food 0.67/s. With Engelsberg, a torp gathers coin 0.75/s. If you have a torp to gather an animal or several woods, then it can be compared to 2.5 vills w/o upgrade, but normally it can’t gather more than 2 vills.

With the upgrades, u can gather berries 1/s and 0.9/s on coin simultaneously.

2 torps are better than a bank lol.

[Jotunir]

Your torps are equivalent to ~3 vills each

With Blueberry, a torp gathers food 0.67/s. With Engelsberg, a torp gathers coin 0.75/s. If you have a torp to gather an animal or several woods, then it can be compared to 2.5 vills w/o upgrade, but normally it can’t gather more than 2 vills.

With the upgrades, u can gather berries 1/s and 0.9/s on coin simultaneously.

2 torps are better than a bank lol.

Outrageous!

[duckzilla]

Sweden in team games is nice. You can boom in relative safety to 20 Torps and send 1. Blueberries, 2. Faster coin gathering for Torps, 3. Blackberries. Your torps are equivalent to ~3 vills each and will gather ~14k food + 8k gold in the next minutes lol.

By the way, where do I find precise numbers on gathering rates of Torps? It is still quite opaque to me from how many sources they can gather at the same time (e.g. 5 trees simultaneously?) and how fast the base gather rates are.

[Efraín]

Sweden in team games is nice. You can boom in relative safety to 20 Torps and send 1. Blueberries, 2. Faster coin gathering for Torps, 3. Blackberries. Your torps are equivalent to ~3 vills each and will gather ~14k food + 8k gold in the next minutes lol.

By the way, where do I find precise numbers on gathering rates of Torps? It is still quite opaque to me from how many sources they can gather at the same time (e.g. 5 trees simultaneously?) and how fast the base gather rates are.

https://www.ageofempires.com/news/aoe3d ... ne-update/

[Efraín]

And replace them with 5/4 villagers. The economy of those cards is what makes the Swedes have the best economy in the game and by far in a very short time.

I would like know all opinions, thanks.

As poisson said that's standardization, besides the berry card is simply bad for swe, so why would you nerf a shipment nobody sends ? And if you remove the torp mine upgrade, Swe is going to suck.

Anyway, as noel said, once people figure out how to play against swe, the full carolean style won't be viable at high level. You still have the mercenary play in fortress though, but at least it will be less lame.

Why swe can create 99 vills pop and 2 factories with those upgrades (specially coin 200% upgrade, lol)?

[dansil92]

Those resources deplete, its not like you sit torps on unlimited coin mines the whole game. When the game goes late they stop being useful, so you're never actually gonna have 99vil 2 factories and 20 torps ticking away on coin

[duckzilla]

Those resources deplete, its not like you sit torps on unlimited coin mines the whole game. When the game goes late they stop being useful, so you're never actually gonna have 99vil 2 factories and 20 torps ticking away on coin

Theoretically, you can send copper mines to make your Torps working again. That is very similar to sending gold crates, just much higher in value and Torps gathering more slowly.

[iamgaming]

With the upgrades, u can gather berries 1/s and 0.9/s on coin simultaneously.

2 torps are better than a bank lol.

Which upgrades? Blueberry increases food gain from 0.335/s to 0.67, and Engelsberg increases coin gain from 0.3/s to 0.75. Do I miss something?

Dutch bank gathers coin 3.3/s with Tulip card. So it gathers more than 3 torps with Engelsberg, more than 2.5 torps with Engelsberg and Blueberry.

[Efraín]

With the upgrades, u can gather berries 1/s and 0.9/s on coin simultaneously.

2 torps are better than a bank lol.

Which upgrades? Blueberry increases food gain from 0.335/s to 0.67, and Engelsberg increases coin gain from 0.3/s to 0.75. Do I miss something?

Dutch bank gathers coin 3.3/s with Tulip card. So it gathers more than 3 torps with Engelsberg, more than 2.5 torps with Engelsberg and Blueberry.

"Gathers all resources next to it simultaneously at half the speed of a settler (via aura; depletes the resources; not improved by villager upgrades)"

If I'm not wrong, the gold improvement gives you 200% compared to the base (0.3/s to 0.9/s) and that of the berries raises it to 1/s directly.

[helln00]

Its been nerfed to 150, 200 was beta only

[Efraín]

Its been nerfed to 150, 200 was beta only

The description in Spanish says 200% or it is a translation error or it has not been nerfed.

And even down to 150%, it's still too strong for a second-age improvement.