Aztec Strong Build Order After Patch?

[Widgie]

Hi All!

First time posting on here! I was wondering whether anybody had some strong Aztec builds that they could offer, I'm not particularly interested in the FI. I want to try and utilise the new cards and changes to see if there's something there. I really enjoy playing Aztec and have only really played them as a rush civ with a strong timing attack (similar to Staryu).

Lemme know

Cheers!

[bsound7]

i mentioned this in the FI thread:
with the calmecac card you can do a faster version of the 10 wp semi ff. you are 45 seconds earlier with spending one more shipment.

the build is:
3v, calmecac, 3wp/fencing school, 700w, 5v, 600c, then it depends on what you want to do. either go for unit shipments and push or go the eco route using the mining card and 1000w. at some point you want to send the 500g unit ups for slinger, coyotes and/or erk. aim for a composition with these three units.
you age fast to age 2 and with the nobles huts to age 3 (with the fast bonus from the calmecac card). you need to make sure that the calmecac card arrives after you reached age 2 such that the bonus is used for the age3 politician.

it is pretty much the build from this thread, just with the new age 1 card: viewtopic.php?t=19282
as for the age 3 cards you want to have: 1000w, 10coy, 13slingers, knight combat, mining card, and the 3 gold upps for slingers, coyotes, erk. add to that maybe 6 skulls, 9 jags, night upgrades, the gold crate or the vills. something like that.

[Garja]

Best build for the FI at the moment is 3v, calmecac, 3wp, 5v 600g, 700w, 900g, 900g. I mean it's more of a semi FI since you maker units waiting for the 2nd 900g to come but can go 600g 900g and age to industrial without units.
Can also stop at the 700w and stay age3 but the mining card is bad because it takes forever to pay off and you need immediate stuff at that point (units or crates to make units).

But I think the meta build should be an age2 timing with 10 wp into either more age2 or aging (now that you have access to the fast age).
Build is 3v, calmecac, 3wp, 700w, units , 600w, units -> push then 600g once or twice (depending if you already have vills on gold or not) if you want to age up.
You get a very strong push with 30/40 military pop backed by the attack dance with 10WPs and then you can be in age3 around 10 minutes so shortly after a classic 8 min semi FF which also had to defend the push so can't fight back immediately.

Another strong option is to do a 4wp FF.
The build is 3v, 3wp, 5v, 600g, 700w. In this case you use the fast age up and then a slow age up to the third age.

[Youssef]

Sending calmecac as first card is better imo. Market start chop for hunting dogs asap and age up with 16v and wh politician, u will be in age 2 at 4 min with a shipment. Then u can send 1 eco card (3wp then 5v to be greedy or 700w to 2nd wh and spam army) then some military shipment and tc big button to attack.

from my experience playing some age 2 before aging up usually is better cause u have 9 slinger coyo combat as very powerful cards.

Another FF build that I like and its stronger now because jpk buff is: market start age up fast with 15v chop for a house in transition then 10 vills do plaza and dance to 10wp and other ones herding hunts. with 700w build a wh and 2 more houses and save 250w. 600g to age up with explorer politician and start training coyotes in transition u have 250w to 10 coyotes and 600w arriving to 1 more batch. In transition 3v on wood 1v on gold rest on food to train 15 coyo and build 2 more houses. As u rech age 3 upgrade slingers and coyotes and get tc BB 2x. After that u will need to chop a lot of wood for houses.
cards: 3v, 3wp, 700w, 600g, 600w, 9slinger, 600g, 8jpk, units shipments

[Widgie]

i mentioned this in the FI thread:
with the calmecac card you can do a faster version of the 10 wp semi ff. you are 45 seconds earlier with spending one more shipment.

the build is:
3v, calmecac, 3wp/fencing school, 700w, 5v, 600c, then it depends on what you want to do. either go for unit shipments and push or go the eco route using the mining card and 1000w. at some point you want to send the 500g unit ups for slinger, coyotes and/or erk. aim for a composition with these three units.
you age fast to age 2 and with the nobles huts to age 3 (with the fast bonus from the calmecac card). you need to make sure that the calmecac card arrives after you reached age 2 such that the bonus is used for the age3 politician.

it is pretty much the build from this thread, just with the new age 1 card: viewtopic.php?t=19282
as for the age 3 cards you want to have: 1000w, 10coy, 13slingers, knight combat, mining card, and the 3 gold upps for slingers, coyotes, erk. add to that maybe 6 skulls, 9 jags, night upgrades, the gold crate or the vills. something like that.

Thanks for getting back to me! I will most likely try and go for the unit shipments after aging rather than going for a further boom strategy! Appreciate your help :)

[Widgie]

Another FF build that I like and its stronger now because jpk buff is: market start age up fast with 15v chop for a house in transition then 10 vills do plaza and dance to 10wp and other ones herding hunts. with 700w build a wh and 2 more houses and save 250w. 600g to age up with explorer politician and start training coyotes in transition u have 250w to 10 coyotes and 600w arriving to 1 more batch. In transition 3v on wood 1v on gold rest on food to train 15 coyo and build 2 more houses. As u rech age 3 upgrade slingers and coyotes and get tc BB 2x. After that u will need to chop a lot of wood for houses.
cards: 3v, 3wp, 700w, 600g, 600w, 9slinger, 600g, 8jpk, units shipments

Interesting! Okay! Many different variations for me to try :)

[fei123456]

My semi-FF build for current patch: 3v, calmecac, 2 war hut travois, 5v 600g 700w, fortress shipments.

So why war hut travois? Why not 3 priest or fencing school?
I do tried 3v - calmecac/calendar dance - 3 priest/fencing school build for some times, but found this build quite slow and vulnerable, while it shouldn't. So I compared the two different build orders:

Old: 3v, 3 priest, 700w, 5v
New: 3v, calmecac, 3 priest, 700w, 5v

I put 1 more shipment on priest boom, and my 3rd shipment becomes the 4th, 4th shipment becomes the 5th. Each shipment cost 15% more experience than the former one, so I'm playing German/India rather than Aztec. Generally I should get 700w right after 3 priests, but with the new build it will arrive until I have 10 priests, which is impossible to hold pressures.
A solution is to skip calmecac and play the old styles, but no, just no. It's a shame to play the old ways in a new patch.

And this is the answer: skip 3 priests. Dance with 2 priests and 10 vills, keep 5 vills on food for TC production. In this way I still get 10 priests at around 6:00, but one shipment is saved.
But well, how do I have resource for units and buildings? Even if I send 700 wood, I don't have extra vills to open crates and build war huts. That's why I send 2 war hut travois.
The travois shipment itself worths 500 wood at least, and it saved a lot of village time. Don't forget it buffs your war huts from 2000 HP to 2400. It may not be better than 700 wood, but it's always better than 600 wood. With this shipment you'll have 2 war huts up at 5:00, without doing anything. You can still send 700 wood later to spam units, and you'll always need 2+ war huts so it's not a waste.

[Widgie]

My semi-FF build for current patch: 3v, calmecac, 2 war hut travois, 5v 600g 700w, fortress shipments.

So why war hut travois? Why not 3 priest or fencing school?
I do tried 3v - calmecac/calendar dance - 3 priest/fencing school build for some times, but found this build quite slow and vulnerable, while it shouldn't. So I compared the two different build orders:

Old: 3v, 3 priest, 700w, 5v
New: 3v, calmecac, 3 priest, 700w, 5v

I put 1 more shipment on priest boom, and my 3rd shipment becomes the 4th, 4th shipment becomes the 5th. Each shipment cost 15% more experience than the former one, so I'm playing German/India rather than Aztec. Generally I should get 700w right after 3 priests, but with the new build it will arrive until I have 10 priests, which is impossible to hold pressures.
A solution is to skip calmecac and play the old styles, but no, just no. It's a shame to play the old ways in a new patch.

And this is the answer: skip 3 priests. Dance with 2 priests and 10 vills, keep 5 vills on food for TC production. In this way I still get 10 priests at around 6:00, but one shipment is saved.
But well, how do I have resource for units and buildings? Even if I send 700 wood, I don't have extra vills to open crates and build war huts. That's why I send 2 war hut travois.
The travois shipment itself worths 500 wood at least, and it saved a lot of village time. Don't forget it buffs your war huts from 2000 HP to 2400. It may not be better than 700 wood, but it's always better than 600 wood. With this shipment you'll have 2 war huts up at 5:00, without doing anything. You can still send 700 wood later to spam units, and you'll always need 2+ war huts so it's not a waste.

Loving the sound of this! I will give this a go after all of the Mexican DLC stuff has died down! Thanks for sharing :)

[Garja]

Bear in mind you end up losing more VS by dancing longer to get 10WPs. Also you can get one war hut (which is usually all you need for semi FF/FI builds) from the age up politician, saving a shipment and making use of the non fast age up politician when they matter the most (2 noble huts is not as useful).
Also you don't need to send 700w before 5v because you're not making units anyway (that saves time and makes it less macro-akward to build the wh while gathering to age up). With 10WP strats your defense comes mostly from the firepit use anyway. And even without 10WPs, you can rely on 3 jags+eagle scouts against early aggression.

I think the reasoning behind that build is quite flawed actually. In fact, the latest patch gives the chance to use one shipment to speed up the semi FF (basically trading xp for time) and since Aztec have abundancy of the former but struggle on the latter, that trade is very inviting.

[Dori]

Best build for the FI at the moment is 3v, calmecac, 3wp, 5v 600g, 700w, 900g, 900g. I mean it's more of a semi FI since you maker units waiting for the 2nd 900g to come but can go 600g 900g and age to industrial without units.
Can also stop at the 700w and stay age3 but the mining card is bad because it takes forever to pay off and you need immediate stuff at that point (units or crates to make units).

@Garja Which council do you use to age2 and age 3? to age4 i think you age with skull knights am i right?

[Garja]

war hut and fast age

[fei123456]

But you saved more VS by sending 2 war hut travois. Imagine how much time you'll spent building 2 huts, and you can't even finish them before enemy raiding. And again you saved tons of VS for 2 noble huts. 4 towers semiFF gives you insane solid defense, you can easily hold any fortress pressure, and switch into fast unit boom from 4 military buildings.

[Garja]

But I'm never building 2 or 4 military buildings in a fast FF-FI strat. Never have the eco to use them, the army comes mostly from shipments.
The only time I may have so many huts is if I am full turtling and going for max vills to then stay in base wtih farms and estates. But it is a different strat

[EliteRifleman]

But I'm never building 2 or 4 military buildings in a fast FF-FI strat. Never have the eco to use them, the army comes mostly from shipments.
The only time I may have so many huts is if I am full turtling and going for max vills to then stay in base wtih farms and estates. But it is a different strat

A query Garja, which is better, advance age first with the messenger and then go up to fortress age with Calmécac and the 2 noble barracks? or is it better to first use Calmécac to get a rax and then go up to fortress age with the messenger?

[Garja]

A query Garja, which is better, advance age first with the messenger and then go up to fortress age with Calmécac and the 2 noble barracks? or is it better to first use Calmécac to get a rax and then go up to fortress age with the messenger?

For the FI it just makes more sense the latter, since 2 noble huts are not needed, while the war hut is.
Also in general calmecac in age1 gives more value because it speeds up the WP boom. And you don't have to wait for the card to dance with 10wps.

[caladbolg]

Anyone know the timings you should be getting for these builds?

I tested the semi-FF (3v, calm, 3wp, 5v, 600g) and am getting 10wp by 5:20-5:30 and age 3 at 8:00 (age at 27v no idle TC). I didn't bother getting an age1 market and just used wood for 2 houses for simplicity.

[Garja]

Ye that's pretty much it. Industrial should be between 10 and 11 minutes if not pressured at all.