AoE3 Tier List (UPDATED APRIL 3)

[WickedCossack]

Surprised to see Japan and Sioux so high =P

Are you really surprised though ? You can say that they''re over-rated but if you didn''t expect to see them voted at this level you''re out of touch with the general community Mitoe.

It also depends a lot on what map pool you are using. Souix &' Japan are stronger on a quicksearch map selection compared with Garja map selection.

Having said that, where did you guys all except Japan to be ?

1) Iroquois: 9.64
2) Ottoman: 9.13
3) India: 8.00
4) Japan: 7.89
5) Aztec: 7.02
6) British: 7.00
7) Sioux: 6.82
8) France: 6.44
8) Germany: 6.44
9) China: 6.16
10) Russia: 5.44
11) Dutch: 4.58
12) Spain: 3.98
13) Portugal: 3.93

It''s currently 4th. Ok Aztecs beats Japan, but then Japan beats India so we''re back to square one.

Who does Japan lose to that''s below it ? Only answer I can kind of see might be France but meh that''s debateable. Consdering it''s a close MU you then have to look at Japan vs other civs compared to French vs other civs and Japan wins out. So Japan >' France in this list.

[Mitoe]

I expected at least Aztec and British to be rated higher than Japan. As for what's below it, I think Japan loses to Aztec, British, France, and Germany (kinda depends on map for this one)' I'm too inexperienced with China/Russia (which are the only other two civs which may have a chance) against Japan to really know for sure, though Japan probably beats those two. Of course Japan can be a strong quick search civ because they can't really be map screwed, but on most maps I think it should be fine.

I also kind of expected France and Germany to be ranked higher than Sioux, but w/e. I guess it's not really that much higher than what I expected because the ones below it (other than Fre/Ger) just suck

[SoldieR]

Why do people think aztec are good?

[Mitoe]

Why wouldn't they be? Have you ever played someone good with them?

[fard]

I would say the top tier civs are the lamest civs in AoE. That means the most played and popular civs of Quicksearch ( which are for sure sioux india otto iro japan german).
I Dont know why, but germany got soo strong like in the last year. Why does it not happened earlier or why the players didnt used it before. And like u already mentioned mitoe. Its super hard MAP dependent. So lets say give otto, iro and Germany a tp map. They become alot more stronger. On the otherhand without a tp i would say iro becomes alot weaker because their opness is at the fast age and fast mass of shipments ya? Same for german because german got used to play like 90% ff and send the shipments. Otto i think would be alot slower in their BO, but they still have jans and abus and mams which makes them just insane strong.So i would not go into this so far. We would need a list for
-water maps without tp
-water maps with tp
-land map without tp
-land map with tp
-tourney maps
I think every civ has more advantages/disadvantages on these types of maps.
Average i dont think we find any "fair top tier list"

[Mitoe]

Yes, the tier list is a little broad, but I was mostly interested in seeing what the general opinion was anyway.

Germany is debatable, there seem to be a lot of mixed opinions on that. I think I'd actually say Iro and Otto are underplayed on quick search in recent months, and maybe Germany's seeming rise in strength is due to this fact, as those are both unwinnable matchups for Germany' that and they're a lot easier to play than most civs, and aren't AS hunt dependent as most civs.

Isn't Iro's totally fine on non-TP maps? =S They have plenty of options other than fast age and still have great unit upgrades. Ottos, on the other hand, still have strong units, true, but suffer the longer the game lasts, and without TPs they can't apply as much pressure in early-mid colonial or fortress where they're normally all but unbeatable.

[cowhax]

I... don't think ppl knew how to vote.

[DivineFire]

I do enjoy the few trolls that went through and put everything as 1... XD

[Good ol Ivan]

For me on 1v1s it's:
-Iros
-Ottos
-India
-Aztecs
-Japs
-Sioux
-Brits
-Germs
-China
-Russia
-France
-Dutchies
-Spain
-Portugal

[Garja]

Japan is actually pretty strong if lamed properly with walls, ashi raids and random aggro builds here and there. They still retain the status of "if not countered win by default civ" and so it all comes to deny opponent counter strat.

Sioux situation is much more clear, if they can raid they usually win, if they can't they usually don't win.

Aztecs are definitely tier2 civ just like India. They have a couple of MUs that seem hard/fair but with specific builds they overcome that.

Germany is indeed strong on this patch. They have a ff-timed semi ff (7.40 or so) and then a lot of fortress potential. And this is all due to the 200w TP. One strat it is, but it's damn strong.

Iro is the best civ regardless of TP actually. They just excel in everything in 1v1 sup. When the tp isnt available they can use the travois for the farm and food up, or at worst save it for a stable in age2.

Otto are imo a bit overrated at the moment. They essentially win because of jan abus huss or mams FF. So basically anything that counter those strats beat otto. And with a fair map many civs go close beating those strats.

Russia is the most understimated civ imo. People just refuse to realize how all around and at the same time sharp the civ is.

[bart331]

I hate "civ tiers" cuz in the end its lots of blablabla and still a way to rough simplification. It also completely denies the fact that maps and treasures have on outcomes of games. In a new gp map brits is arguably top civ while on deccan india is insane.

So wtf we discussing here?

[Good ol Ivan]

Japan is actually pretty strong if lamed properly with walls, ashi raids and random aggro builds here and there. They still retain the status of "if not countered win by default civ" and so it all comes to deny opponent counter strat.

Sioux situation is much more clear, if they can raid they usually win, if they can''t they usually don''t win.

Aztecs are definitely tier2 civ just like India. They have a couple of MUs that seem hard/fair but with specific builds they overcome that.

Germany is indeed strong on this patch. They have a ff-timed semi ff (7.40 or so) and then a lot of fortress potential. And this is all due to the 200w TP. One strat it is, but it''s damn strong.

Iro is the best civ regardless of TP actually. They just excel in everything in 1v1 sup. When the tp isnt available they can use the travois for the farm and food up, or at worst save it for a stable in age2.

Otto are imo a bit overrated at the moment. They essentially win because of jan abus huss or mams FF. So basically anything that counter those strats beat otto. And with a fair map many civs go close beating those strats.

Russia is the most understimated civ imo. People just refuse to realize how all around and at the same time sharp the civ is.

What do you mean with "this patch"? I thought this thread was about civs without the fan patch?

And yeah Japs are really strong - imho they are the OPest civ outside 1v1s.
Ottos may be overrated, but abus are just too strong and it''s so easy to play them.

[Garja]

Tp used to cost 250w in the previous patch (before 2010 or so).

[Good ol Ivan]

oh, yeah. But, well, you kinda confused me because it's been so many years without a balance-alterimg patch

[Goodspeed]

It has, hasn't it...

[SoldieR]

Japan is actually pretty strong if lamed properly with walls, ashi raids and random aggro builds here and there. They still retain the status of "if not countered win by default civ" and so it all comes to deny opponent counter strat.

Sioux situation is much more clear, if they can raid they usually win, if they can''t they usually don''t win.

Aztecs are definitely tier2 civ just like India. They have a couple of MUs that seem hard/fair but with specific builds they overcome that.

Germany is indeed strong on this patch. They have a ff-timed semi ff (7.40 or so) and then a lot of fortress potential. And this is all due to the 200w TP. One strat it is, but it''s damn strong.

Iro is the best civ regardless of TP actually. They just excel in everything in 1v1 sup. When the tp isnt available they can use the travois for the farm and food up, or at worst save it for a stable in age2.

Otto are imo a bit overrated at the moment. They essentially win because of jan abus huss or mams FF. So basically anything that counter those strats beat otto. And with a fair map many civs go close beating those strats.

Russia is the most understimated civ imo. People just refuse to realize how all around and at the same time sharp the civ is.

Wow..I agree.
Actually everything you said is pretty much spot on with me, except that India is tier 2. IMO they are #1 civ with a few counter strats.
Good points on Russia too.

[Goodspeed]

Germany is indeed strong on this patch. They have a ff-timed semi ff (7.40 or so) and then a lot of fortress potential. And this is all due to the 200w TP.

It was already one of their best options on FP. 50w isn''t th?t big of a difference. Not getting 2 uhlans with the 3sw is, though.

[Garja]

But you can't do tp start if it costs 250w?

[Goodspeed]

You don't need to, just build it during age up and you're still up at 7:40 with a shipment ready.

[Mitoe]

You actually can still do TP with 250w on 200w starts, but you might have to 18v sometimes. I was doing it on Nilla for a while.

[nandoray]

CURRENT STANDINGS AFTER 69 VOTES (3 April 2015):
1) Iroquois: 9.32
2) Ottoman: 8.81
3) India: 7.68
4) Japan: 7.55
5) British: 7.09
6) Aztec: 6.72
7) Sioux: 6.54
8) France: 6.52
9) Germany: 6.38
10) China: 5.97
11) Russia: 5.70
12) Dutch: 4.71
13) Portugal: 4.01
14) Spain: 3.99
Why is france so low? Spain >' Portugal.. and WTF!! Aztec and Sioux <' France IMO.

[Good ol Ivan]

I disagree, if anything I find Germs, Russia and China stronger in 1v1.
France IMHO is pretty average/mediocre in 1v1.
They shine through their late game which makes them an above average civ, but I wouldn't call them an optimal choice for a standard 1v1.

[nandoray]

whhhaaaat? lol french villagers can kill mace and puma... so coy vs hussar? come on man France maybe mediocre but it still outranks sioux and azzy hands down.
i know what you mean though.. trying them as a beginner doesnt scream OP, but they is almost Japan with their turtle.

[miloslav]

I always chear for underdog but daamn, Portugal I like them. I hope they are not that bad as it looks like in that chart lol.
Btw: I do not want to make new thread so I will ask here. Is there any map pack for nilla? I can not find cheap retail version around here and steam version cost almost 40 Euro which is too much for me as student so I play nilla only for now.