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United States of America Durokan
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19 Jan 2016, 02:11

*original write-up by bugattivitesse but was lost in site migration*
Image

PIROSHIKI FF (Spain)

This is a very fast fast fortress designed to get to age III, and spam Spain's excellent fortress age unit cards.

This is by no means my strategy, it has been made by Piroshiki, a top player on ESO, that primarily uses this strategy with Spain. I just have an obsession with it, and so I thought I would post.

Why Spain? Spain is generally thought as an under-powered civ, so why do this strategy as Spain? Here are a couple reasons:

1) Fast shipments. As you all probably know, Spain needs less XP to earn a home city shipment, making a TP a bonus, but not a necessary part of this strategy.
2) Great age III unit cards. Spain has numerous excellent unit shipments once they hit age III, combined with fast XP, they can get these on the battlefield faster than any other civ.
3) Explorer who can use war dogs. This can be used to get bigger treasures to get a faster age up, and when you push as a nice melee unit.

Necessary Cards

Image

That is a sample deck. I would consider removing 1000 food, and maybe adding a mercenary card, such as 9 highlanders.


The Build Order

Age 1:
First card is 3 villagers. Do NOT build a house with the starting wood.You will get a 2nd shipment most of the time, save it for age 2.
If you have 200w at the start build a TP. If you do not, skip the TP for the entire game/
This build order is a bit weird. Starting out, produce villagers until you have 9, then send 3 villagers. Your pop should be 12/10. Tha'ts perfect.
Age up with the tower and 200 gold.
Age 2: Send 700 gold, and then 700 wood. With the 200 gold from the age up, and the 700 from shipments, you have 900. That makes 100 to either gather, or get from treasures. You should generally click up around 5:10 - 5:25. Either go up with the 4 hussars, or 8 pikes. Build the tower wagon somewhere aggressive, near the enemy base, but off to the side. This will be the drop off point for you military shipments.
Using the 700 wood, build 5 houses and a barracks, then distribute your villagers to prepare for skirmisher production. (generally 7 on gold, 5 on food)
Age 3: As soon as you hit age III, queue up as many skirmishers as you can. Then send 2 falconets. This is where the BO ends.

Tips:
-Protect your falconets at all costs. They are the protection against any massed heavy infantry.
-Use your pikes to kill houses. Avoid melee fighting, unless it is cavalry you are fighting.
-Don't forget to use war dogs and your explorer! He is a free, 500 HP unit, and the dogs take out enemy skirmishers or longbows with ease.


Recs: These were lost :c

Please comment to improve this strat! Thanks!
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viewtopic.php?p=98718#top
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France [Armag] diarouga
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19 Jan 2016, 06:18

This is bad.
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Sweden 91
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19 Jan 2016, 06:23

[Armag] diarouga wrote:This is bad.

This feedback is bad.

Thank you for the guide, I am sure it will be useful to many players!
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No Flag fightinfrenchman
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19 Jan 2016, 06:27

[Armag] diarouga wrote:This is bad.


Wow great post
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No Flag thebritish
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19 Jan 2016, 06:35

I think there was another Spanish FF where you age with 500 food and gather the gold..
Is this FF better than the old one?

Btw, nice guide ;)
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China fei123456
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19 Jan 2016, 07:40

if you have 200w for a start tp, 9+3 is available.
if not, 15p is better.
It's already a war, and I have nothing to lose.
----diarouga
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Bavaria Gichtenlord
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19 Jan 2016, 09:42

12 vills only seems so bad. I can already imagine that a good player can just stall long enough until his superior eco kicks in
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Great Britain britishmusketeer
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19 Jan 2016, 09:43

fightinfrenchman wrote:
[Armag] diarouga wrote:This is bad.


Wow great post

Not much more to say about this strat lol
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No Flag fightinfrenchman
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19 Jan 2016, 10:16

britishmusketeer wrote:
fightinfrenchman wrote:
[Armag] diarouga wrote:This is bad.


Wow great post

Not much more to say about this strat lol


Typical forum elitism, how can you consider "This is bad" to be constructive criticism?
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Great Britain britishmusketeer
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19 Jan 2016, 10:32

fightinfrenchman wrote:
britishmusketeer wrote:
Show hidden quotes

Not much more to say about this strat lol


Typical forum elitism, how can you consider "This is bad" to be constructive criticism?

It was a joke but realistically, standard Spain is objectively much better.
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China fei123456
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19 Jan 2016, 10:55

speed >all. 2 cannon at 8:00 is quite different from 10:00.
12p ff is not the best spain bo but at least it's available. (h2o lost to piroshiki some times lol)
with a start tp (200w start) 9+3 seems to be a decent choice.
It's already a war, and I have nothing to lose.
----diarouga
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India _DB_
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19 Jan 2016, 10:56

Coup is correct. Speed really matters, and for such a civ it is highly significant.

The build isn't bad at all. This is bad sometimes.

You forgot to mention what piroshiki exactly does with 200w start on TP map.

He send 12/10 without house and make TP with 200w. He send 3 vils>300w. With 300w he make another TP and a house. This allows him to reach age 3 around 7.00 and still having two shipments ready, and vs aggressive he send 8 pikes/6 rods to defend.

It is very good on maps with low hunts where you cannot go Garja Spain.
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United States of America IAmSoldieR
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19 Jan 2016, 11:00

The church card is missing; it is essential to the piro FF with halbs xD
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India _DB_
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19 Jan 2016, 11:06

yeah, church card is missing too.

You also missed 300w, 12 swiss pikes and 600 coin.
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Great Britain britishmusketeer
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19 Jan 2016, 11:15

It only worked because re maps are so bad and because people didn't adapt to it.
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France [Armag] diarouga
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19 Jan 2016, 11:52

It is bad that's all. Don't do it is the only advice I can give you.
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United States of America Durokan
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19 Jan 2016, 11:55

[Armag] diarouga wrote:It is bad that's all. Don't do it is the only advice I can give you.

I had briefly said somewhere that it is important for a new player to familiarize themselves with alot of strategies. It is important to have this build somewhere because it is something that a player could play against. This strategy is good against players who do not prepare for the timing, and knowing the build and timings can help you prepare.
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viewtopic.php?p=98718#top
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France [Armag] diarouga
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19 Jan 2016, 11:57

Durokan wrote:
[Armag] diarouga wrote:It is bad that's all. Don't do it is the only advice I can give you.

I had briefly said somewhere that it is important for a new player to familiarize themselves with alot of strategies. It is important to have this build somewhere because it is something that a player could play against. This strategy is good against players who do not prepare for the timing, and knowing the build and timings can help you prepare.

Only 1 player does it and 15v age up is as fast but you have 5 more vills+ 8more pikes, so what's the point to prepare vs this build but not vs the standard all in?
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China fei123456
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19 Jan 2016, 12:19

[Armag] diarouga wrote:
Durokan wrote:
[Armag] diarouga wrote:It is bad that's all. Don't do it is the only advice I can give you.

I had briefly said somewhere that it is important for a new player to familiarize themselves with alot of strategies. It is important to have this build somewhere because it is something that a player could play against. This strategy is good against players who do not prepare for the timing, and knowing the build and timings can help you prepare.

Only 1 player does it and 15v age up is as fast but you have 5 more vills+ 8more pikes, so what's the point to prepare vs this build but not vs the standard all in?

no.
how do you have 5 more vill 8 more pike? you have 15+2 and piro has 12+2. and he can send 8 pike before age 3 too.
also a colonial push wont have lancer and cannon lol.
It's already a war, and I have nothing to lose.
----diarouga
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India _DB_
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19 Jan 2016, 12:54

If Piro can win games, it shouldnt be too bad
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Greece tedere12
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19 Jan 2016, 14:16

it can be good sometimes, it is a cheesy strat and with a good treasure like 140 food it would be really strong imo
#FreeTheCheese
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Great Britain britishmusketeer
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19 Jan 2016, 15:16

_DB_ wrote:If Piro can win games, it shouldnt be too bad

Piro has a high(ish) pr (33) and a low(ish) 1v1 elo (2100). And he doesn't play team. Basically means that he wins (relatively for his pr) alot vs lower level players and loses (relatively for his pr) alot vs higher level players. This means that his build can win alot of games at a lower level, but will never work vs a higher level player in the long run with the exception of imbalanced RE maps. That is the definition of a bad build imo.
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Bavaria Gichtenlord
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19 Jan 2016, 15:17

britishmusketeer wrote:
_DB_ wrote:If Piro can win games, it shouldnt be too bad

Piro has a high(ish) pr (33) and a low(ish) 1v1 elo (2100). And he doesn't play team. Basically means that he wins (relatively for his pr) alot vs lower level players and loses (relatively for his pr) alot vs higher level players. This means that his build can win alot of games at a lower level, but will never work vs a higher level player in the long run with the exception of imbalanced RE maps. That is the definition of a bad build imo.

+1
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Sweden 91
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19 Jan 2016, 15:36

britishmusketeer wrote:
_DB_ wrote:If Piro can win games, it shouldnt be too bad

Piro has a high(ish) pr (33) and a low(ish) 1v1 elo (2100). And he doesn't play team. Basically means that he wins (relatively for his pr) alot vs lower level players and loses (relatively for his pr) alot vs higher level players. This means that his build can win alot of games at a lower level, but will never work vs a higher level player in the long run with the exception of imbalanced RE maps. That is the definition of a bad build imo.


you can delete 99% of all guides if you are going to aim to copy only tourney winners' strats. Please be happy that we get strategies that could go on the strategy wall. Some content is always nice, and as you said, if it works in lower PR, what is wrong? It means people can use it. Just label it in the guide that it will not work as good vs higher ranked players, I don't see the problem!?

Nobody can get better if they are forced having to start out with 35+ strategies
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Great Britain britishmusketeer
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19 Jan 2016, 16:26

91 wrote:
britishmusketeer wrote:
_DB_ wrote:If Piro can win games, it shouldnt be too bad

Piro has a high(ish) pr (33) and a low(ish) 1v1 elo (2100). And he doesn't play team. Basically means that he wins (relatively for his pr) alot vs lower level players and loses (relatively for his pr) alot vs higher level players. This means that his build can win alot of games at a lower level, but will never work vs a higher level player in the long run with the exception of imbalanced RE maps. That is the definition of a bad build imo.


you can delete 99% of all guides if you are going to aim to copy only tourney winners' strats. Please be happy that we get strategies that could go on the strategy wall. Some content is always nice, and as you said, if it works in lower PR, what is wrong? It means people can use it. Just label it in the guide that it will not work as good vs higher ranked players, I don't see the problem!?

Nobody can get better if they are forced having to start out with 35+ strategies

I see your point and I never said it should be deleted or anything. I was just disagreeing with db when he said it can't be bad since piro wins games. Although I would also say that it must be I'd say that you improve the most by doing the optimal strategies (few of which are particularly hard to execute anyway)

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